Throwing Toys Over The Gate

[Lucy]

i would ignore it. i wouldn't give it back, i wouldn't pick it up - nothing.

they like to throw something so you'll pick it up and give it back. it's fun.

they might even start crying and throwing a fit when you DON'T.

it's up to you if you want to give into that or not.

i'd just pick them all up at the end of the day or naptime.

YES. This is spot on.

[dEHmom]

I had the same thought. Not specifically about Cesar, but I was thinking "so you train them like a DOG???"

I think Casar has a great method that is useful in more than just dog training. That's why he is the "whisperer" .


The mentality of a pack aka group. Everyone needs to be in harmony.

training a dog is not about being a bully and scaring the crap out of him so he listens or doesn't do bad things. Fact is, that if you scare them, they just don't do bad things when you are there. When you are gone it's fair game.

Same concept with children.

My dad was strict. He terrified us, so we didn't do bad things *cough cough* We just got better at hiding things, sneaking around, etc.

So it sounds bad that it is training "like a dog" but I think it's more so training a dog like a child. Meet all their basic needs (food/water/exercise/love) and teach them the right way to behave, not scaring the bejeezus out of them into doing what you want them to do.

Fact for myself, maybe not for all of you:

I get lots of chubby bratty kids in my daycare. Introduce exercise and proper eating, they are no longer brats. They are angels.

mcd's and tv = hyper brats
veggies and soccer = angels

[Crystal]

wow....this is not the first time training and treating children as part odf a pack or a dog has been mentioned on this forum. wow. just wow.

[dEHmom]

wow....this is not the first time training and treating children as part odf a pack or a dog has been mentioned on this forum. wow. just wow.

I'm not saying treat children like dogs if that's what it sounded like.

I just mentioned that in daycare/classrooms its a group setting, and everyone needs to work together and be in sync with each other. If one kid is running around and screaming, the rest will surely follow.

Caesar Milan when talking about the dogs, talks about the "group" mentality. HE understands the dynamics of groups/packs and that is why he is successful with what he does.

He teaches that you must mean what you say. It's not about screaming and yelling, it's saying what you mean. That is why many kids walk all over moms/dads because they threaten, but never follow through.

Mom "if you dont' eat your supper you are going to bed with nothing!"
Kid- doesn't eat supper, throws it on floor
Mom- sends kid to bed, but allows them to come out for bowl of cereal once dishes are cleaned up.

hmmm....wonder why that kid is breaking curfew at 16 yo.


Might be wrong, but I think Caesar Milan mentioned that he raised siblings? And just had the knack for the dogs because of this? Maybe he took what he knew from raising children, and put it towards training dogs?

It's not a bad thing. Many things can be applied to everyday things, from gardenings to child rearing to automotive repairs, etc.

[dEHmom]

potty training / house breaking a dog

same poop different pile

[SimpleMom]

Many of my little ones do this between 1 and 2 yrs old. It's the "fill and dump" stage as I like to call it I usually offer a box of some sort (not cardboard if they really into chewing things) and encourage them to make a basket so-to-speak. I do have a lot of toys at the bottom of my steps that I would pick up at the end of the day. Now that I am in the basement the favorite place to throw toys is over the fire place gate (fp is unused). Not many can reach over it, so my general rule is that I pick up those toys every friday. Works pretty good for my group. They do outgrow it. Also, a small basket ball hoop indoors helps for when they are older. Something they can play with you.

[nannyde]

wow....this is not the first time training and treating children as part odf a pack or a dog has been mentioned on this forum. wow. just wow.

wow what?

of course we have things in common with other species that have a beating heart. We have commonality with bears, lions, tigers, dogs, wolves, mountain goats, sheep, cows....

You can go the route of "you treat kids like dogs" or you can go "what do we have in common with THAT species?". You can twist it any way you would like but it doesn't change that we have commonality between dogs as they have evolved on the same planet over time just like we have.

We currently have "child led" which I dare say is not replicated in any other species... but I could be wrong.

[Live and Learn]

Very young children completely understand boundaries.

[SandeeAR]

Very young children completely understand boundaries.

Sadly, it is usually the parents that don't understand boundaries and won't set them and teach them.

[nannyde]

Very young children completely understand boundaries.

Yes
In order to get to developmentally appropriate you have to actually understand the development part of it.

[Meyou]

A little off topic but my way of explaining to parents how I get the kids to all stay together when we go on outings is this:

As long as they see mama duck moving the baby ducks always follow.

I have a rule that you do not have to hold hands on the sidewalk IF you're close enough to touch my shirt. The duck part reminded me of the group/pack comparisons being made.

[kendallina]

This discussion is crazy and one of the reasons that I rarely respond to discipline threads on the board. I cannot imagine making a boundary for no reason. The issue has nothing to do with getting close to a gate. The issue has to do with a 1-year old doing a very developmentally appropriate activity of throwing toys over a gate, something that helps him learn cause and effect. The boundaries that some providers make for children are so needlessly stifling and just don't seem to make any sense. So, if you create a tape boundary then you are creating several new issues that the provider has to deal with...what if he puts a foot on the tape, what if he drops a toy inside the taped line, what if he has a great pitching arm and gets the toy over the gate anyways (we've all known plenty of toddlers who can do this). It's just creating more issues for the provider and for the child to have to worry about. I would hate to have to walk on eggshells at some of our providers houses.

The suggestions of giving him a laundry basket to drop toys into is a great idea. Also, if he continues to drop items over the gate, then it's over the gate and gone and he can watch it from his side of the gate. Cause and effect. He'll soon no longer drop the toys that he really wants and soon he'll be done with this stage.

And, yes, many of the suggestions for how to work with children on this board deserve a nice little eye roll so here you go . Call it disrespectful or whatever you all would like, but I would rather be disrespectful to providers who don't care enough about their children to educate themselves on proper ways of working with children then to sit back here while inappropriate advice gets doled out time and time again.

[Crystal]

This discussion is crazy and one of the reasons that I rarely respond to discipline threads on the board. I cannot imagine making a boundary for no reason. The issue has nothing to do with getting close to a gate. The issue has to do with a 1-year old doing a very developmentally appropriate activity of throwing toys over a gate, something that helps him learn cause and effect. The boundaries that some providers make for children are so needlessly stifling and just don't seem to make any sense. So, if you create a tape boundary then you are creating several new issues that the provider has to deal with...what if he puts a foot on the tape, what if he drops a toy inside the taped line, what if he has a great pitching arm and gets the toy over the gate anyways (we've all known plenty of toddlers who can do this). It's just creating more issues for the provider and for the child to have to worry about. I would hate to have to walk on eggshells at some of our providers houses.

The suggestions of giving him a laundry basket to drop toys into is a great idea. Also, if he continues to drop items over the gate, then it's over the gate and gone and he can watch it from his side of the gate. Cause and effect. He'll soon no longer drop the toys that he really wants and soon he'll be done with this stage.

And, yes, many of the suggestions for how to work with children on this board deserve a nice little eye roll so here you go . Call it disrespectful or whatever you all would like, but I would rather be disrespectful to providers who don't care enough about their children to educate themselves on proper ways of working with children then to sit back here while inappropriate advice gets doled out time and time again.

What a refreshing post. Thank you!

[SandeeAR]

Reading this thread got me to thinking. I think the biggest thing that causes discord on this board, is the differences in folks.

If you all will honestly look at the threads, you will see what I have been seeing......we have providers that have been "schooled" by higher education offering their opinions. And then we have providers that have been "schooled" by real life.

There are good things to both. I think if both types of providers would try and consider the other point of view some,there would be less discord.

That said, you have to consider this:

Non-degree folks, will never have your text book knowledge.

Degreed folks that have never raised their own children, will never have the knowledge of someone that has raised children.

I personally do not have that "degree", never wanted one. I became what I wanted to all my life. A MOM!!!

I read a lot of child rearing books as my DD's were growing. However, not ONE book, prepared me for this job, as much as having raised my own kids did.

Just food for thought.

[dEHmom]

I posted on the providers spouse thread about how we often are quick to judge the others comments. However, after reading most or all of everyone elses opinions, it can help us see the light/widen our horizons, etc.

I have changed my opinion, method, or style of parenting and providing for other peoples children based on a lot of the information I have found on here.

I do agree with you Sandee that we shouldn't be so quick to the gun.

Every one of us is human, have our own brains, thought processes, and whatever else. And everyone of us in entitled to our own opinions. We all need to consider other peoples WITHOUT putting them down.

If there is something that alarms us about someones post, yes there is a right to approach it and maybe show them or offer advice on how to deal with it appropriately, but I too have taken a break from this site due to the overwhelming critical aspects of the replies some people have to offer. I don't like being told I'm wrong, but I appreciate constructive feedback.

So I apologize to any one of you that I may have been critical or rude, or mean, or anything else to. I do not mean to be. Sometimes my opinions get the better of me.