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  • Country Kids
    Nature Lover
    • Mar 2011
    • 5051

    Originally posted by daycare
    Noo sorry not rules for the children just more on the business side
    OK, that I understand!

    I just seriously don't understand though how there can be so many "different" rules. Especially if there is only one rules/reg. book!
    Each day is a fresh start
    Never look back on regrets
    Live life to the fullest
    We only get one shot at this!!

    Comment

    • daycare
      Advanced Daycare.com *********
      • Feb 2011
      • 16259

      Originally posted by Country Kids
      OK, that I understand!

      I just seriously don't understand though how there can be so many "different" rules. Especially if there is only one rules/reg. book!
      I think the issue is that it's that licensing has the power to read the rules as they see fit. They determine them how they want and there is nothing that states they can't.

      Comment

      • sharlan
        Daycare.com Member
        • May 2011
        • 6067

        Originally posted by daycare
        I think the issue is that it's that licensing has the power to read the rules as they see fit. They determine them how they want and there is nothing that states they can't.
        Yes, it appears that everything in Title 22 Regulations, all 80 pages of it, is open to individual interpretation of the analysts.

        Comment

        • mom2many
          Daycare.com Member
          • Jun 2011
          • 1278

          Originally posted by Crystal
          I had mentioned it before and am still very serious about conducting a research study on the Cali Regs from county to county.

          Give me a couple of weeks to finish some stuff I am doing here and I will develop a Methodology and start a research group in the social groups section on the forum. I will invite all Cali girls to participate.

          Seriously, something NEEDS to be done about the lack of consistency.
          I would LOVE to see something done! I have been frustrated for years with the lack of consistency regarding licensing regs and would be happy to invest time in this research.

          Comment

          • Michelle
            Daycare.com Member
            • Jan 2011
            • 1932

            Originally posted by Blackcat31
            Obviously California regulations/rules are VERY open to interpretation depending on which licensor or area you live in........so




            if that is the case ^^ Does passing an inspection with flying colors REALLY mean anything?



            * I am NOT being snarky......really I am not.

            But if licensors/agencies in California can't even agree on ONE basic set of rules, then a perfect inspection record really doesn't mean much.

            Especially considering the fact that if any other licensor or agency did the inspection some things you normally do wouldn't pass then, right?

            I feel really badly for providers in your state because the rules/regs are so confusing and complex and even worse for the parents as they really have no way of knowing if their provider is following the correct or incorrectly interpreted regulations.
            Actually yes!
            We are not allowed to have all the baby equipment that most states are allowed. Taking care of babies is a little harder for us because we don't have the luxury of putting baby in a bouncy seat or stationary activity (walker) for just a minute to take someone to the bathroom, or make lunch, we can't have them safely in the crib in the living room playing with toys when the toddlers are being extra energetic ( to protect them... not leave them there all day) In a lot of ways, our regs. are more strict than most states and when we pass every surprise inspection, then we are doing a great job!
            So, yes I would rather follow the rules to the letter than to say to a licenser..." well Bubba is here to fix my sink because Nan's toilet exploded everywhere and she did it! "or Crystal says I can have an array of people here around these kids because she said "as long as it is for a good reason"

            Nope, not going to happen! I would not do that to these kids, my own daughter, or my business!

            Comment

            • Blackcat31
              • Oct 2010
              • 36124

              Originally posted by Michelle
              Actually yes!
              We are not allowed to have all the baby equipment that most states are allowed. Taking care of babies is a little harder for us because we don't have the luxury of putting baby in a bouncy seat or stationary activity (walker) for just a minute to take someone to the bathroom, or make lunch, we can't have them safely in the crib in the living room playing with toys when the toddlers are being extra energetic ( to protect them... not leave them there all day) In a lot of ways, our regs. are more strict than most states and when we pass every surprise inspection, then we are doing a great job!
              So, yes I would rather follow the rules to the letter than to say to a licenser..." well Bubba is here to fix my sink because Nan's toilet exploded everywhere and she did it! "or Crystal says I can have an array of people here around these kids because she said "as long as it is for a good reason"

              Nope, not going to happen! I would not do that to these kids, my own daughter, or my business!
              I think you are missing my point. I am saying it is virtually impossible for you to follow the rules to the letter since there are NO clear rules and regs to follow.

              When you say that you pass surprise inspections with flying colors, that means nothing as the inspection wasn't the SAME inspection the provider in the next county receives since it seems ALL areas of California follow the rules as they believe them to be, which isn't at all similar to one another.

              Also, since you brought up the infant equipment topic, there are many states that don't allow use of infant equipment. My state is NOT one of them but I don't use ANY infant equipment at all. I care for 12 children daily ranging in age from 4 months to 5 years old and I have never had an issue using the rest room or leaving the room for a minute while an infant is present.

              My older kids are trained well.

              Comment

              • daycare
                Advanced Daycare.com *********
                • Feb 2011
                • 16259

                Originally posted by Blackcat31
                I think you are missing my point. I am saying it is virtually impossible for you to follow the rules to the letter since there are NO clear rules and regs to follow.

                When you say that you pass surprise inspections with flying colors, that means nothing as the inspection wasn't the SAME inspection the provider in the next county receives since it seems ALL areas of California follow the rules as they believe them to be, which isn't at all similar to one another.

                Also, since you brought up the infant equipment topic, there are many states that don't allow use of infant equipment. My state is NOT one of them but I don't use ANY infant equipment at all. I care for 12 children daily ranging in age from 4 months to 5 years old and I have never had an issue using the rest room or leaving the room for a minute while an infant is present.

                My older kids are trained well.
                This is so true! One of my friends that lives 2 miles down the road we both get inspection about one month ago.

                I passed, she didn't. We had the same women. She was written up for her bathroom trash can no lid, but it was under the bathroom sink cupboard. Mine was exactly the same but I did not get the write up.

                Not sure if the licensor missed it or just didn't care the day she was at my house.
                My friend also got write up for a bird bath she has in her front yard, even though its empty?...

                We still can't figure it out.

                You never know what to expect when they come

                Comment

                • sharlan
                  Daycare.com Member
                  • May 2011
                  • 6067

                  This is on page 50 of the Health and Safety Code.

                  1596.871. Fingerprints and criminal record information of individuals in contact with child day care facility clients; exemptions; criminal records clearances.

                  The Legislature recognizes the need to generate timely and accurate positive fingerprint identification of applicants as a condition of issuing licenses, permits, or certificates of approval for persons to operate or provide direct care services in a child care center or family child care home. It is the intent of the Legislature in enacting this section to require the fingerprints of those individuals whose contact with child day care facility clients may pose a risk to the children's health and safety. An individual shall be required to obtain either a criminal record clearance or a criminal record exemption from the State Department of Social Services before his or her initial presence in a child day care facility.

                  (iii) A volunteer who is a relative, legal guardian, or foster parent of a client in the facility shall be exempt from the requirements of this subdivision.
                  (iv) A contracted repair person retained by the facility, if not left alone with children in care, shall be exempt from the requirements of this subdivision.

                  Comment

                  • sharlan
                    Daycare.com Member
                    • May 2011
                    • 6067

                    Originally posted by daycare
                    This is so true! One of my friends that lives 2 miles down the road we both get inspection about one month ago.

                    I passed, she didn't. We had the same women. She was written up for her bathroom trash can no lid, but it was under the bathroom sink cupboard. Mine was exactly the same but I did not get the write up.

                    Not sure if the licensor missed it or just didn't care the day she was at my house.
                    My friend also got write up for a bird bath she has in her front yard, even though its empty?...

                    We still can't figure it out.

                    You never know what to expect when they come
                    Yes, that's so true. I got written up for my tomato plants, but someone else one here that lives a few miles away, in the next city, next county, didn't get written up.

                    Comment

                    • mom2many
                      Daycare.com Member
                      • Jun 2011
                      • 1278

                      Originally posted by Blackcat31
                      I think you are missing my point. I am saying it is virtually impossible for you to follow the rules to the letter since there are NO clear rules and regs to follow.

                      When you say that you pass surprise inspections with flying colors, that means nothing as the inspection wasn't the SAME inspection the provider in the next county receives since it seems ALL areas of California follow the rules as they believe them to be, which isn't at all similar to one another.

                      Also, since you brought up the infant equipment topic, there are many states that don't allow use of infant equipment. My state is NOT one of them but I don't use ANY infant equipment at all. I care for 12 children daily ranging in age from 4 months to 5 years old and I have never had an issue using the rest room or leaving the room for a minute while an infant is present.

                      My older kids are trained well.
                      This absolutely true! I had an unannounced visit in July 2009 and everything was 100% in compliance. In Jan 2010 another licensing rep came out and said my bathroom vanity did not have the proper childproof locks. She said that in "her opinion" the tot locks (magnetic locks) are the only ones deemed "inaccessible" and that in Santa Clara Co. they wanted providers to use these. I was told this is not mandated statewide. Each county is different, because they cannot agree on this!

                      The regs only state that items need to "inaccessible" so it really is up to an individual and how they interpret this. I had no issue using this new type of childproof lock, but did object with being cited for something that had been approved just 6 months earlier and had been used for over 20 years with no issues at all.

                      I wish regs were more black and white in CA. I'm all for following rules...just be "CLEAR" and "CONSISTENT" what they are!!!!!

                      Comment

                      • mom2many
                        Daycare.com Member
                        • Jun 2011
                        • 1278

                        Originally posted by daycare
                        This is so true! One of my friends that lives 2 miles down the road we both get inspection about one month ago.

                        I passed, she didn't. We had the same women. She was written up for her bathroom trash can no lid, but it was under the bathroom sink cupboard. Mine was exactly the same but I did not get the write up.

                        Not sure if the licensor missed it or just didn't care the day she was at my house.
                        My friend also got write up for a bird bath she has in her front yard, even though its empty?...

                        We still can't figure it out.

                        You never know what to expect when they come
                        So VERY true!

                        I had an empty birdbath for years and no one said anything about it...then this past summer the licensing analyst said she wanted it filled with little rocks even though it was empty. I wasn't cited for it though and just did as she wished.

                        I've never heard of a trash can needing a lid...

                        Comment

                        • daycare
                          Advanced Daycare.com *********
                          • Feb 2011
                          • 16259

                          Originally posted by mom2many
                          So VERY true!

                          I had an empty birdbath for years and no one said anything about it...then this past summer the licensing analyst said she wanted it filled with little rocks even though it was empty. I wasn't cited for it though and just did as she wished.

                          I've never heard of a trash can needing a lid...
                          Me either.... Like we all say here.... Who knows!!!!

                          Comment

                          • sharlan
                            Daycare.com Member
                            • May 2011
                            • 6067

                            I was asked to cover the tops of my air conditioning units with a wire mesh so that the kids could not drop rocks in them. It is not in the regs, just something my analyst asked because they had had several reports of injuries from kids dropping rocks in and the fan blades kicking them back out.

                            I was not written up, but it is in the report that the analyst must have access to my dh's gun safe on his next visit. It is in a locked garage, BEHIND a tent trailer. If I can't get into it, how in the world are the kids going to? I didn't know where the keys were, but it's in my report that I must know where the keys are and grant the analyst access.

                            Those are things that my analyst asked for, they are nowhere in the Title 22 Regs or Health and Safety Codes.

                            A neighbor was told by a different analyst that she had to have locks on all upstairs doors and they had to remain locked during the day, even though the kids do not have access to the upstairs. She was told an older child could climb the gate at the base of the stairs and go upstairs so they had to be locked.

                            Comment

                            • sharlan
                              Daycare.com Member
                              • May 2011
                              • 6067

                              Originally posted by mom2many
                              So VERY true!

                              I had an empty birdbath for years and no one said anything about it...then this past summer the licensing analyst said she wanted it filled with little rocks even though it was empty. I wasn't cited for it though and just did as she wished.

                              I've never heard of a trash can needing a lid...
                              My kitchen trash has to have a lid, my bathrooms don't.

                              Comment

                              • Jewels
                                Daycare.com Member
                                • Aug 2010
                                • 534

                                I may not be in california, but not having anyone ever in the house to fix or do something, not happening, I have my carpets cleaned 4x per year, and its always when the kids are here, but we all go somewhere else in the house to let them do there thing, in the spring/summer/fall we go outside. If my toilet were to explode, um I'm pretty sure there is NO WAY I would wait until all children were gone to have someone come and fix it. That would be ridiculous.

                                Comment

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