Not Sure What to Think - Peanut Allergy

[LysesKids]

Again, I do not think a home daycare needs to accommodate a child with an allergy if they are not comfortable doing so. The provider must be able to safely care for all children in her care...simply that they enjoy nuts in the home is enough in my opinion, being the only adult present is enough in my opinion, being too far remote from EMS is enough in my opinion, but it does seem like having an adult with diabetes say that PB is the only thing that will work to stabilize their blood sugar is not accurate.

I am assuming the discomfort many home providers have is with all life-threatening food allergies (except maybe seafood) and not just peanut allergies.

If that is the argument that the provider is using to turn away kids with allergies, them what about milk, soy, wheat, egg and other life-threatening allergies? No reputable medical doctor is going to say you need all of those for emergency management of diabetes.

Actually I have been doing some research & YES, even home providers, licensed or licensed exempt, are required to follow ADA law because they are considered public businesses; the exception is if it causes undo hardship to remodel or in my case (& the OP), problems with our health due to extreme allergies... just because a kid has an allergy or needs to use an EPI or even a service animal is not a reason to turn away a child (in my case due to allergies to cats & dogs I can say no on this)

I also have health issues that would be affected taking this child - that and I have another child already in care that needs the nut flours & such because he can't actually have regular flours, dairy or soy; in my case I can say no, in houses where the provider or another child doesn't have life threatening issues, then yes a parent can force the ADA down their throat. They even say on the website that added insurance cost is not a legal reason to turn away a kid... they say you have to spread the cost between all the families. Everyone do your homework because it can affect you next

[KiddieCahoots]

My daghter is and has been highly allergic to peanuts.....needs epi pens, throat will swell up, etc.
I run the daycare in the way that keeps her safe, and will oblige others that need the same care, but will not exclude peanuts from the environment.
This is just craziness!!!
Is it really that necessary that we need to protect ourselves, for the responsibility of one in our "in home daycare"?
Do we have a moral responsibility to this as daycare providers?

[nannyde]

Actually I have been doing some research & YES, even home providers, licensed or licensed exempt, are required to follow ADA law because they are considered public businesses; the exception is if it causes undo hardship to remodel or in my case (& the OP), problems with our health due to extreme allergies... just because a kid has an allergy or needs to use an EPI or even a service animal is not a reason to turn away a child (in my case due to allergies to cats & dogs I can say no on this)

I also have health issues that would be affected taking this child - that and I have another child already in care that needs the nut flours & such because he can't actually have regular flours, dairy or soy; in my case I can say no, in houses where the provider or another child doesn't have life threatening issues, then yes a parent can force the ADA down their throat. They even say on the website that added insurance cost is not a legal reason to turn away a kid... they say you have to spread the cost between all the families. Everyone do your homework because it can affect you next

This is true BUT

To my knowledge the Department of Justice has never sued a home child care to force them to take a child or punish them for not taking one. My theory is that their expectations that cost of care should be dispersed among the current clients can so easily be proven as substantial financial impact.

Let's say you have a kid that needs care that would cost you a mere hundred a week in staff time and hard cost. For example, you have a seizure kid who must have direct visual supervision during nap every day. At ten bucks an hour for a helper, that's $100 a week.

You have five clients and in order to spread the cost you must raise rates $20 a week or $86 per month.

When you announce you must raise rates 10 to 20 percent a month the clients would just leave. It would take one day of having that convo with the parents and you would loose them all.

A center with 200 kids would spread the cost at fifty cents a day or approximately a half of a percent increase.

When going after home daycare they have to be sure the client base CAN support the cost. With the small number of clients it's very easy to prove the cost would close the business. The provider would have to close down and then reopen when the special needs kid found care elsewhere. Then she could reopen until the next one came along with their special needs needs.

Making a home peanut free is a ton of staff time and MUST be compensated by tuition. The extra labor of checking every kid every day... doing an additional hand washing and face cleaning, face cleaning, takes time. Doing parent conferencing to lay down the rules AND making the agreement that THEY are responsible to male sure ANYONE who drops off or picks up is trained takes TIME. Reading labels takes A TON OF TIME. Shopping specifically for these foods takes WAY more time and the cost of the food is more expensive.

The parents of the daycare MUST pay for ALL of that. If it's fifty cents a day they would. If it's four a day they won't.

That math is for ONE kid. Soon as the next special needs comes along then the money starts again. What needs to be understood is that the DOJ doesn't expect the provider to do ANY of it for free. They expect the cost to be shared. When you only have four ... five... six... seven families it takes next to nothing to elevate the cost to the point where they will just leave and go to a daycare where they don't have to pay for special needs kids. They have a hard enough time paying for their own. Average parents won't do it unless it's pennies.

[momofapreschooler]

As a parent of a child with an allergy, I can attest that it does take a TON of time. Perhaps I am interpreting ADA incorrectly (and honestly for a home preschool I did not think it would apply), but because I know the lengths we go to in order to keep my child safe, I cannot imagine that a home provider with other children present could do it except in the most unusual of circumstances.

Those who have been providers for a long time...is it uncommon for a parent to try to force you to keep a child that you feel you cannot care for safely?

[Thriftylady]

As a parent of a child with an allergy, I can attest that it does take a TON of time. Perhaps I am interpreting ADA incorrectly (and honestly for a home preschool I did not think it would apply), but because I know the lengths we go to in order to keep my child safe, I cannot imagine that a home provider with other children present could do it except in the most unusual of circumstances.

Those who have been providers for a long time...is it uncommon for a parent to try to force you to keep a child that you feel you cannot care for safely?

Well as a child care provider it is just one MORE thing I worry about being sued over. If someone trips in my driveway and they decide to, they can sue me. If they are mad because they didn't pay and I termed them, they can call in a false accusation that costs me time and money to fight. And if they are mad because I say I can't take a child with a peanut allergy, that may be reason for that accusation if nothing else.

[momofboys]

I agree... normally kids get into peanut butter & such before 3 years; heck, I have 1 year olds eating it. If there was an allergy that was that bad I think they would already know. Believe me, most my babies that have allergy issues start showing signs by 12 months ( inc chemicals/scents which is one of my issues); BTW, I also have 3 allergies that are life threatening... 2 are food that I can NEVER EAT in any form much less touch ( needless to say I do not serve them in my childcare home )

Not necessarily. I have a PA DS & we didn't know he was allergic because he was born at a time when they still recommended not giving kids PB until they were 2 or 3. So I was a strictly by the book mom & never gave him peanut foods. He had other allergy issues (egg) so when he was tested at 2 we found out he had a very strong PA.

[Thriftylady]

And on a side note I saw something the other day saying that they think part of the reason for so many peanut allergies is that we quit giving kids peanut products as babies. Not sure if they have done studies yet or not.

[momofboys]

Perfect!

Wow! Insensitive. Although if I didn't have a child with nut allergies I probably wouldn't want to accommodate a child with them either I find this very insensitive. Just say you can't do it.....no reason to push the item that could cause death as a means to get the parent to turn you down. I didn't tag the right post I meant to tag the post about having PB cookies out at each interview. I don't expect special for my kids & would never expect a provider to give me "special" (one of the reasons I stayed home with my child when he was not in school) but being kind goes a long way!

[momofboys]

Well as a child care provider it is just one MORE thing I worry about being sued over. If someone trips in my driveway and they decide to, they can sue me. If they are mad because they didn't pay and I termed them, they can call in a false accusation that costs me time and money to fight. And if they are mad because I say I can't take a child with a peanut allergy, that may be reason for that accusation if nothing else.

I think most allergy parents don't want to sue, they just want their child to live and not have to worry about every single item that enters their mouth.

[LysesKids]

This is true BUT

To my knowledge the Department of Justice has never sued a home child care to force them to take a child or punish them for not taking one. My theory is that their expectations that cost of care should be dispersed among the current clients can so easily be proven as substantial financial impact.

Let's say you have a kid that needs care that would cost you a mere hundred a week in staff time and hard cost. For example, you have a seizure kid who must have direct visual supervision during nap every day. At ten bucks an hour for a helper, that's $100 a week.

You have five clients and in order to spread the cost you must raise rates $20 a week or $86 per month.

When you announce you must raise rates 10 to 20 percent a month the clients would just leave. It would take one day of having that convo with the parents and you would loose them all.

A center with 200 kids would spread the cost at fifty cents a day or approximately a half of a percent increase.

When going after home daycare they have to be sure the client base CAN support the cost. With the small number of clients it's very easy to prove the cost would close the business. The provider would have to close down and then reopen when the special needs kid found care elsewhere. Then she could reopen until the next one came along with their special needs needs.

Making a home peanut free is a ton of staff time and MUST be compensated by tuition. The extra labor of checking every kid every day... doing an additional hand washing and face cleaning, face cleaning, takes time. Doing parent conferencing to lay down the rules AND making the agreement that THEY are responsible to male sure ANYONE who drops off or picks up is trained takes TIME. Reading labels takes A TON OF TIME. Shopping specifically for these foods takes WAY more time and the cost of the food is more expensive.

The parents of the daycare MUST pay for ALL of that. If it's fifty cents a day they would. If it's four a day they won't.

That math is for ONE kid. Soon as the next special needs comes along then the money starts again. What needs to be understood is that the DOJ doesn't expect the provider to do ANY of it for free. They expect the cost to be shared. When you only have four ... five... six... seven families it takes next to nothing to elevate the cost to the point where they will just leave and go to a daycare where they don't have to pay for special needs kids. They have a hard enough time paying for their own. Average parents won't do it unless it's pennies.

Yes, but the Justice Dept has sued & won an ADA suit against one major daycare center... ( La Petite) - and it was just the one center that it sued not the corp... if a parent pushes the the issue it could bankrupt a provider. This is why I have certain paragraphs in my contract; one that is signed when registering the baby - that all medical & mental issues have been disclosed to provider including known allergies. If I could prove she had known in advance, this wouldn't even be an issue here

[nannyde]

Yes, but the Justice Dept has sued & won an ADA suit against one major daycare center... ( La Petite) - and it was just the one center that it sued not the corp... if a parent pushes the the issue it could bankrupt a provider. This is why I have certain paragraphs in my contract; one that is signed when registering the baby - that all medical & mental issues have been disclosed to provider including known allergies. If I could prove she had known in advance, this wouldn't even be an issue here

They have sued a number of CENTERS. I'm not aware of any case law of them suing home care. I even asked Tom Copeland and he isn't aware either.

[LysesKids]

They have sued a number of CENTERS. I'm not aware of any case law of them suing home care. I even asked Tom Copeland and he isn't aware either.

Understood, but there is always a first for everything

[nannyde]

Understood, but there is always a first for everything

I would guess when they contact home child care they scare them into submission. It's VERY important to understand the MONEY of the ADA. The section where they expect the cost to be spread out. That's the.money shot.

Also, be WILLING to do in depth time studies when you are presented with accommodation. Time IS money and the TIME for this special need is significant. It doesn't have to be hard work... just work that takes TIME. Our time must be compensated. Every label read takes time. Every extra washing. Every parent conference with parent and other kids parents. It all takes time.

[Thriftylady]

I would guess when they contact home child care they scare them into submission. It's VERY important to understand the MONEY of the ADA. The section where they expect the cost to be spread out. That's the.money shot.

Also, be WILLING to do in depth time studies when you are presented with accommodation. Time IS money and the TIME for this special need is significant. It doesn't have to be hard work... just work that takes TIME. Our time must be compensated. Every label read takes time. Every extra washing. Every parent conference with parent and other kids parents. It all takes time.

You are making me feel better about this. What you are saying makes perfect sense. It is just so scary anymore with all these things. And yes I believe that children with allergies deserve and should have quality care. I just think that small business owners (because that is what we are) also deserve a fair shot.

[MyAngels]

Can you just block her number if she keeps calling? Both my home phone provider and my cell phone have options to do that. When a blocked number calls my phone they get a message that my phone number is not accepting calls from the calling party or something to that effect.

Here's to hoping she'll just drop it already