Discrimination at Jo-Ann's Fabrics and Crafts

[TomCopeland]

I've been talking to a provider in Kansas City who has tried unsuccessfully to participate in the "Teacher's Rewards" program at the Jo-Ann Fabrics stores. They have a policy of giving a 15% discount card to "teachers" who are defined as K-age 12 public and private school teachers, as well as home-school teachers. She tried to explain why family child care providers and other preschool teachers should be included, but was turned down. I wrote about this on my blog: www.tomcopelandblog.com ("Are Family Child Care Providers Teachers?").

I note that the IRS gives a $250 tax credit to "teachers" but not preschool teachers. This law has been around since 2002 and was just extended to 2011.

I think this is unnecessarily discriminatory and think all preschool teachers should get such discounts. Maybe if enough providers make their voices known we can change Jo-Ann Fabrics policy. I'm urging providers to post comments on the Jo-Ann Fabric Facebook page and several have done so already.

[Cat Herder]

I am in. I have a huge load of linens in the dryer. I've got nothing but time right now ::::

[KEG123]

That would be awesome if they gave a 15% discount to us!! I shop Han**** though. The Joanne around here is a bit too far.

[Lucy]

Do preschool teachers have the amount of education that K-12 teachers do? I've always wondered that. Just what ARE the requirements to be a preschool teacher?

[QualiTcare]

Do preschool teachers have the amount of education that K-12 teachers do? I've always wondered that. Just what ARE the requirements to be a preschool teacher?

it depends - Head Start teachers have to have an associate's degree (at least where i live) but there are pre-K programs in public schools and they have to have a bachelor's degree.

if the policy included only licensed teachers, i would understand and support the policy. what's the point of going to college for 4 years and getting a license if you get the same "benefits" that are offered to any and everyone? SINCE they offer the discount to homeschool teachers - the policy makes no sense. you can teach homeschool (in my state) with a GED. there are no credentials other than that - none.

i wonder if it has more to do with the fact that daycare providers are FOR profit while licensed teachers and homeschool teachers are NOT for profit rather than the fabric company "doesn't consider daycare providers as teachers."

[Abigail]

I think we should either be licensed or maybe just registered providers to be able to say one of our jobs is being a teacher...obviously family child care providers have many jobs of owning and operating their own business. There should be "something" that shows "proof" or else anyone can walk into these establishments and claim to be a teacher. Thanks for sharing Tom, I'll be sure to go to their FB page.

It would also help if individuals typed letters to the corporate office (if they want to make a change) and explain how often they take their business to Jo-Ann Fabrics (or any other company that they want to get that teacher discount <Hobby Lobby!>) and feel they're under-appreciated as a customer because they--as a corporation--do not properly acknowledge the customer's title in our line of work, which should make them equally eligible to receive a discount.

[Lucy]

i wonder if it has more to do with the fact that daycare providers are FOR profit while licensed teachers and homeschool teachers are NOT for profit rather than the fabric company "doesn't consider daycare providers as teachers."

I like that distinction. Maybe the reason they want to give discounts to K-12 teachers is that they struggle with low wages that they have no control over due to budget cuts. We, as self-employed Providers, have much more control about how much we make. We can raise rates or take more kids, increase our hours, etc.

[Cat Herder]

I am pretty sure both of my sisters work as teachers in public schools for a profit.....:::::: Also alot of us have degrees in other fields, too....

Eh, it is worth a try since I send almost half of my craft glue, scissors and paper to the public school for my kids teachers since the budget cuts.

[QualiTcare]

I am pretty sure both of my sisters work as teachers in public schools for a profit.....:::::: Also alot of us have degrees in other fields, too....

Eh, it is worth a try since I send almost half of my craft glue, scissors and paper to the public school for my kids teachers since the budget cuts.

yeah, teachers get paid, but the schools are not for profit AND stats show that teachers spend money out of their pocket to buy supplies - the number varies depending on where you look, but generally $500-$1000. how many non-business owners buy their own supplies? secretaries aren't buying copy paper. nurses aren't buying needles. there are many people who are employed by agencies that are non-profit. the agencies get tax breaks, but the employee of course gets paid. it also has zero to do with having a degree in another field. that would make as much sense as me trying to get a discount on medical supplies even though i'm not a doctor, "but i have a degree in another field."

either way, it's irrelevant because the discount isn't offered to only licensed teachers - it's offered to homeschool teachers with a GED. that's why i think it must have more to do with for profit vs. non-profit than how daycare providers are perceived.

[mac60]

Our teachers get paid very well here in the public school system, excellent working conditions, have top of the line benefits, have approx 4 mo a year off when you add up the summer vacations, Spring break, Chrsitmas break, plus all the other holidays.....it is rediculous to say they are underpaid. Seriously, they have it made.

[QualiTcare]

Our teachers get paid very well here in the public school system, excellent working conditions, have top of the line benefits, have approx 4 mo a year off when you add up the summer vacations, Spring break, Chrsitmas break, plus all the other holidays.....it is rediculous to say they are underpaid. Seriously, they have it made.

actually schools runs 180 days per year so it's closer to 6 months, but who's counting?

[nannyde]

Tom what does this mean? "The way to overcome this ignorance is to be proactive in educating others about the positive impact preschool teachers make on the lives of young children. All the research supports this."

What research are you refferring to?

I have to agree with JoAnn's on this. The child care industry has done this to themselves. The misues of the word teacher has finally been CAUGHT by big business.

In my State you can have a Center with three hundred kids and not have a single person in the building that has even a GED except for the director who has to have a high school diploma.

Every single center in my area calls their staff teachers. The staff can walk into the building without a high school education and not even a GED and within a couple of days of background checking and a physical they can be put into a room and be called Teacher from that day on. The amount of "education" they have to have is a two hour child abuse class and by the anniversary of their first year of service they have to have tweleve hours of CHILD CARE classes that are NOT college classes. When I say twelve hours I mean twelve sixty minute hours. THAT'S IT.

The state of Iowa does NOT regulate that term. The Centers use the word because it makes them money. It makes the parents feel like their child is with an educated person.

I can't speak to the home schooling part because I don't know their reasoning for that but I say cheers to them for taking a stand on this term that is so misused.

I hope you haven't been smitten by the research on poor kids and early childhood intervention. YES preschool is valuable to children who are the poorest of the poor and who live in underprivledged environments. Other than that subsect of the population, I haven't found any research to back up that preschool makes any signficant difference in any measurable life outcome for lower middle class, middle class, upper middle class, or wealthy children. That's the blunt of our kid population.

You said: Are Family Child Care Providers Teachers?
Jacqueline Crocker always thought so. She has been a licensed family child care provider in the Kansas City area for over 20 years. She is accredited by the National Association for Family Child Care (NAFCC)

Here is the NAFCC's Eligibility criteria: http://www.sncs.org/downloads/provid...pplication.pdf


Be at least 21 years of age. Have a high school diploma or GED.
Provide care to children for a minimum of 15 hours per week.
Provide care to a minimum of three children in a home environment.
At least one child must not reside in the provider’s home.
Be the primary caregiver, spending at least 80% of the operating hours actively involved with the children.
Co-providers must spend at least 60% of the time actively involved with the children.
Have at least 12 months experience as a family child care provider. Meet the highest level of regulation to operate a family child care program by the authorized regulatory body.
Be in compliance with all regulations of the authorized regulatory body . Have a favorable state and federal criminal history.
Be in good health in order to provide a nurturing and stable environment for children.
Maintain a current CPR and Pediatric First Aid certification. Adhere to the NAEYC Code of Ethical Conduct .

You see why JoAnn's doesn't accept that as proof of being a teacher?

[DCMom]

Our teachers get paid very well here in the public school system, excellent working conditions, have top of the line benefits, have approx 4 mo a year off when you add up the summer vacations, Spring break, Chrsitmas break, plus all the other holidays.....it is rediculous to say they are underpaid. Seriously, they have it made.

Same here.

[Crystal]

There are many companies that offer teacher discounts. I tried years ago to use my child care license to obtain the discounts, to no avail. Once I went to school and obtained my Master Teacher Permit through the state teacher credentialing system, I began recieving the disounts.

Honestly, I think the 15% is a drop in the bucket to companies like JoAnnes, and they should extend the offer to providers out of goodwill. BUT, technically they can refuse it, as providers are NOT teachers unless they have a credential to prove it.

I do think that many provders use the term "teacher" loosely and shouldn't advertise as a preschool if they do not have the education to provide a DAP preschool program, but that's a whole 'nother issue

[QualiTcare]

I hope you haven't been smitten by the research on poor kids and early childhood intervention. YES preschool is valuable to children who are the poorest of the poor and who live in underprivledged environments. Other than that subsect of the population, I haven't found any research to back up that preschool makes any signficant difference in any measurable life outcome for lower middle class, middle class, upper middle class, or wealthy children. That's the blunt of our kid population.

i remember you saying this in another thread awhile back. yesterday i was telling my husband i may take my son out of preschool. i put him there because his sister goes to school during the day and i thought it would be good for him socially and to get prepared for kindergarten. his "teacher" seems to think he's doing great *in comparison to the other children*, i'm sure he is. i have done my own assessments and he doesn't know half of what i *know* he should know by now. he has HOMEWORK which consists of coloring alphabet people. what is the point in coloring a picture of "mr. N" or writing the letter N on lined paper when you don't recognize the letter N or what it sounds like? needless to say, he doesn't do his homework. i do make pudding and let him write letters or i give him paint (like you write on windows with) and let him write letters on the mirror. i'm just not willing to make and fight with him color what equates to japanese and call that learning the alphabet. i don't know what his "teacher" thinks about his folder being sent back with blank papers in it. ::

anyhow, i think you're right. "poor parents" which usually equates to uneducated parents wouldn't see a problem with making a pre-schooler do that type of "work." it's probably the ONLY exposure they get to letters, numbers, etc. so of course it would benefit them because the alternative is NO exposure.

i've never been a fan of homeschool because i've never thought everyone (not no one) with a GED could teach their children the way they need to be taught. i was reading up on homeschooling yesterday because i'm considering doing it when i finish up my BSN and will be able to work 3, maybe 4 days per week. i still haven't changed my opinion that anyone with a GED shouldn't be able to homeschool though.