Out of Control Child

[Willow]

Reactive Attachment Disorder just very briefly - http://www.aacap.org/AACAP/Families_...sorder_85.aspx

I still think ODD and conduct disorder are also very real possibilities. Hopefully with this new professional you'll get a very good second opinion and some great therapy options.

[countrymom]

do you have a childrens treatment center, when she's in her mood bring her there or bring her to the hospital and have her immediately admitted. Sometimes you have to take drastic measures.

also, call a child shrink. they can help you. Your dd doesn't sound like adhd but more on the lines of anger issues and she doesn't know how to express herself.

I have had a boy who used a stress ball when he was angry. to me, it sounds like your child gets mad when she doesn't get her way and she wants to be the boss. Have you tried when you discipline her to have her sit on your lap and you wrap your arms around her, kind of like a saftey thing.

also, I would document for one week everything that sets her off. Maybe its what she is eating, or maybe she is hungry after school. Maybe can she take a nap after school. What is the age difference between her and your other children.

[Heidi]

Ok, I am just throwing this out there, but have you looked into dietary changes?

I have heard anecdotal evidence that some children's behavior changes dramatically when certain additives such as dyes, corn syrup, or gluten is removed. Apparently, there are no conclusive studies, but it might be worth a try to eliminate the most famous culprits and see if there's any improvement.

http://www.cspinet.org/nah/3_00/diet_behavior.html

Have you been to a neuropsychologist? My close friend's daughter had severe behavior issues as a young child, but ended up getting comprehensive testing done. They ended up diagnosing her with OCD. She was diagnosed at 8 or so, but at 4 and 5, she still threw a lot of tantrums. The reason turned out to be that the OCD frustrated her so much, she would loose it.

An example would be that at 4 or so, she still had trouble getting her shoes on. When her mother offered to help, she'd say no. She HAD to do it herself. But, a half hour later, tears and throwing shoes and major meltdowns; and they'd all be a wreck.

She also HAD to be first going up the stairs, or through a doorway, etc. It SEEMED like she was just super-bossy, but she NEEDED to be the first one.

Once she was diagnosed with the OCD, they reluctantly put her on a low dose of Paxil. Her obsession with perceived poison in all the food made her loose 20 pounds over a few months, and so my friend "caved" and decided to try medication. After a few days, it was like someone flipped a switch.

So, now she's 15, and she's a bright, quirky young lady. She is still on medication, but at her age, she's much more aware of her condition and can manage the behaviors as well.

I'm telling you all this because ther e is hope! Keep looking for answers, and you will find it!

[Heidi]

I just thought of something else. Can you make a deal with her, that if she plays nicely during pick ups, she can earn 10 minutes of one-on-one with mommy as soon as the other kids go home?

You will play whatever game SHE wants, HER rules, for TEN minutes! Then, tell her exactly what she has to do to earn that. Whenever a parent comes in, she has to go sit at the table and color (or another specific activity).

During her one-on-one time, make sure there's no interruptions, even if it means parking your other children in front of a screen for that 10 minutes. Go in her room with her and let her be in charge for that long.

If she even messes up a little, though, she doesn't get the special time. She sounds like a smart little girl and she will push to see if you cave.

[Unregistered]

Have some adult stay with her in another room to be entertained from 4 to 5 during pick up times

[Unregistered]

I have started keeping a diary of her behavior so when she is seen in 3 moths they can have a better look at what's going on. We have changed her diet several times hoping that would help. One of our other children has Celiacs disease so she has been on a gluten free diet for a few months now also excluding all dyes.

We need a referral to see any specialist. I can call her ped to see if that might help and if maybe we can get in sooner to see a neuropsychologist than the specialist a few hours away. So far she hasn't been evaluated for OCD. I never thought of that because she doesn't count things a certain number of times exc. I will absolutely keep that in mind when I talk to them!

I have tried giving her rewards for being good during pick up time. I will remind her right before I open the door but if pick up time lasts more than 2-3 minutes then its like she completely forgets. Once they leave I will tell her you lost out on your reward. Sometimes she will be upset but most of the time she doesn't care.

I don't have another adult here during pick up time for someone to take her to another room

[Familycare71]

What if you gave her a job?? If you need to make some up. It would help her feel in control and would help her focus on something while pick ups are going on-

[Evansmom]

I read through the whole post and first I want to say I have so much compassion for you and your situation. You are doing the best you can for her!

This sounds so very like my son when he was young. He's now 15 and has thankfully "grown out" of most of it. Many people thought he had ODD however he really had SPD. Sensory Processing Disorder. He was sensory seeking but couldn't detect when he'd had enough and would end up in total meltdown when he was over stimulated. Oh the tantrums we withstood between the ages of 2 and 9!

Now that he's bigger he can control the situations he feels overstimulated in and can avoid things he doesn't like.

Maybe look into SPD with your daughter? I know there is physical therapy the can get that helps tremendously.

[Maria2013]

is she hungry or tired.
you see, I don't play games. If your going to be naughty after school then you can go to your room. She's doing it for attention. Do you talk to her when she comes home, or do you just tell her to wait. My kids are always telling me about school, try listening to 4 kids at once and 2 daycare kids who want to tell me about their day, its crazy. I also believe that for bad behavior their needs to be consequences.

logical consequences are easy for a 6yr old to understand so whatever her reasons, she has to understand that behavior is not appropriate and will not be tolerated

[Maria2013]

I just want to add that I have kids of my own and at times, out of jealousy or frustration, they too tent to misbehave, now I love them and I understand their reasons to act the way they do, but for me to do anything about it they need to first correct their behavior....first you behave and then we talk about whatever it is that's bothering you, and that is something I make sure all of the kids in my daycare learn too

[Unregistered]

I read through the whole post and first I want to say I have so much compassion for you and your situation. You are doing the best you can for her!

This sounds so very like my son when he was young. He's now 15 and has thankfully "grown out" of most of it. Many people thought he had ODD however he really had SPD. Sensory Processing Disorder. He was sensory seeking but couldn't detect when he'd had enough and would end up in total meltdown when he was over stimulated. Oh the tantrums we withstood between the ages of 2 and 9!

Now that he's bigger he can control the situations he feels overstimulated in and can avoid things he doesn't like.

Maybe look into SPD with your daughter? I know there is physical therapy the can get that helps tremendously.

Thank you so much! I talked to the daycare parents today explaining that I will need to take a day off for an evaluation. Unfortunately they weren't very understanding. Taking the day off wasn't the issue since I rarely use my days off. It was the evaluation part. One of my new parents is a special needs teacher at a high school. Out of any of the parents I thought he would be the most understanding.

[Luvnmykidz]

This may be far out there, but she reminds me a little of my dd before she was diagnosed. Several things were causing her meltdowns and behavior issues. She slept fairly well but after a sleep study we learned she wasnt sleeping deep enough which is why she woke in the middle of the night and seemed to be annoyed so easily. Melatonin and later clonidine helped her sleep better and also calmed her enough in the daytime that ABA therapy and OT was beneficial. Also we learned that their were sensory issues. Certain types of clothes that she wore (denim, anything scratchy or lose fitting) seemed to also be a culprit. Leggings, cotton material helped. We also started her on a sensory diet (not food, just activities to give input) to give her constant sensory input. I am no therapist, but would be happy to share all that it entails if you would like to try it. We used a balance board, bodysox(spandex type body suit to give sensory input), small trampoline, weighted vest for therapy and weighted blanket for relaxing/calming(I wasn't comfortable using it for her to sleep with). We also used a behavior method with behavior bucks. She used them to earn T.V./computer time, special one-on-one time, toys out of our "home store"(a container filled with small squishy fidget toys, play-doh, bubbles,extra sensory box time coupons, and a few other things she liked). During this time she was labeled ADHD and on the spectrum, her pedi and psychologist also felt like she had ODD. I know this is all very stressful for you and for her as well :hug:. She is really blessed to have a mom like you and I pray things get better. I'm sorry that your families are not as understanding as you hoped they would be, but stay strong and keep pushing for an answer. This is a wonderful place for you to come to for support as well as just to vent.

[Familycare71]

Thank you so much! I talked to the daycare parents today explaining that I will need to take a day off for an evaluation. Unfortunately they weren't very understanding. Taking the day off wasn't the issue since I rarely use my days off. It was the evaluation part. One of my new parents is a special needs teacher at a high school. Out of any of the parents I thought he would be the most understanding.

Really!? I'm mad for you!!
How when they are seeing the behavior are they not understanding to you wanting to find a solution and cause for it??
:hug: hang in there!!!

[Unregistered]

Sorry hectic day! Our church classes start tonight. Which is really my only break from kiddos. I get to read/crochet exc in quiet for 90 minutes. So glad Summer is over so church is back in sessions. First day back didn't turn out so great, she lasted 30 minutes.

At this point I'm more hurt than angry at the daycare parents. In a few days I will be angry

I am very interested in hearing more about the sensory disorder!

[blandino]

This may be far out there, but she reminds me a little of my dd before she was diagnosed. Several things were causing her meltdowns and behavior issues. She slept fairly well but after a sleep study we learned she wasnt sleeping deep enough which is why she woke in the middle of the night and seemed to be annoyed so easily. Melatonin and later clonidine helped her sleep better and also calmed her enough in the daytime that ABA therapy and OT was beneficial. Also we learned that their were sensory issues. Certain types of clothes that she wore (denim, anything scratchy or lose fitting) seemed to also be a culprit. Leggings, cotton material helped. We also started her on a sensory diet (not food, just activities to give input) to give her constant sensory input. I am no therapist, but would be happy to share all that it entails if you would like to try it. We used a balance board, bodysox(spandex type body suit to give sensory input), small trampoline, weighted vest for therapy and weighted blanket for relaxing/calming(I wasn't comfortable using it for her to sleep with). We also used a behavior method with behavior bucks. She used them to earn T.V./computer time, special one-on-one time, toys out of our "home store"(a container filled with small squishy fidget toys, play-doh, bubbles,extra sensory box time coupons, and a few other things she liked). During this time she was labeled ADHD and on the spectrum, her pedi and psychologist also felt like she had ODD. I know this is all very stressful for you and for her as well :hug:. She is really blessed to have a mom like you and I pray things get better. I'm sorry that your families are not as understanding as you hoped they would be, but stay strong and keep pushing for an answer. This is a wonderful place for you to come to for support as well as just to vent.

There is an article I have read about a little boy who had such big tonsils that he had sleep apnea and never went into REM sleep. His mother specifically mentioned that he was a great sleeper, no matter how bad his behavior was. He was diagnosed as autistic, just because of the effects of no REM sleep.

It seems to me that this could very likely be a contender. Especially since you said she sleeps well. To me that would be her body trying to make up for the poor quality of sleep by getting extra time sleeping.