Accidents On Purpose? And How To Handle This DCM?

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  • daycarediva
    Daycare.com Member
    • Jul 2012
    • 11698

    Accidents On Purpose? And How To Handle This DCM?

    This is long-sorry!

    I have a dcb, almost 3/next month and has been potty trained for a good 4-5 months with very infrequent accidents. Yesterday he peed in his pants during AM clean up time, so I sent him to the bathroom to change and the kids finished cleaning up. I thought nothing of it. THEN he did it at PM clean up time. The timing was a little TOO perfect. I held back some toys and he cleaned them up when he was done getting changed.

    Mom way over reacted to his accidents at pick up (imo), even though I said NOTHING about the timing of them. She read over his take home sheet, bent down to dcb and said "Dcb is something bothering you? What happened to make you so upset you wet your pants?" and dcb said "My friends was mean to me!" Mom started to make a fuss over him, so I intervened and asked dcb when his friends were mean and dcb says "They not give me the cars!" and I explained to Mom that dcb has a difficult time sharing the cars and of course his perception of his sharing and those of his friends are quite different, and that the free play incidents and the accidents were spaced far enough apart that the timing was off, kids just have accidents, there doesn't need to be a reason. blah blah She left in a huff, then sent me texts later about it, and his not napping yesterday-or ever-, which I ignored (after hours!)

    This morning she came in, ignored me completely and was all cheery and asked dcb "Now if your friends won't share with you, what are you going to tell them?" and dcb said "My say YOU HAVE TO SHARE FRIENDS!" and dcm smiled sweetly at me and left.

    Today, dcb has had 3 accidents. ALL at times he has to do a non-preferred activity, am clean up, outside clean up and lunch clean up and I am CERTAIN he will have an accident at PM clean up as well.

    After his third accident dcb said "Na-na I no has to clean up!" and ran to the bathroom. I left ALL OF his mess at the table and it was waiting for him when he was done. He threw a MASSIVE fit, tossed his plate on the floor (filled with veggies that he never eats) and tried to go join the other kids on the rug for story time. I redirected dcb back to cleaning up. Since he doesn't nap anyway (whole different story), it was no inconvenience to me to allow unlimited clean up time. I told dcb that as soon as he was finished cleaning up, he could join us. Well, everyone is done with stories, hand washing, pottying, teeth brushing and is asleep and dcb still refuses to touch a single pea or piece of broccoli. They.were.everywhere. I even tried offering to help and he said "I not helping!" I sent him to lay on his nap mat and just cleaned it up myself.

    W T H? How would you handle this kid? Mom?

    He is part time- 2 days per week. Nap issue is that his Mom tells him he doesn't have to sleep, just rest so he wiggles, moves, bothers friends, makes noise, to keep himself awake. Mom prefers he not nap because he falls asleep at 6:30-7 instead of 7:30-8. I do require that he lay QUIETLY on a mat and look at books/quiet toys. Mom disagrees and has TOLD me that she asked around and 'that seems to be the standard of care for kids who aren't comfortable enough to sleep away from home'.
  • preschoolteacher
    Daycare.com Member
    • Apr 2013
    • 935

    #2
    Oh man.

    This seems so challenging. Especially because he's only coming part time. In my opinion, that is not enough for your rules to start applying to him. He'll go home and transition back to those rules, and then be re-set again by the next time he comes to daycare.

    It doesn't seem like Mom is willing to work with you--she has her mind made up about what is happening/what she wants to happen.

    I'll be interested to see what she says when you tell her about the multiple accidents that all happened at clean up time. It would be hard to ignore the (seemingly clear!) evidence that he's probably having accidents to avoid cleaning up.

    Comment

    • Play Care
      Daycare.com Member
      • Dec 2012
      • 6642

      #3
      Honestly? Today mom would be met with "Sally, I am unable to meet dc boys needs, so I am giving you notice. His last day will be _____."
      Too much work for a PT kid, IMO.

      Comment

      • daycare
        Advanced Daycare.com *********
        • Feb 2011
        • 16259

        #4
        Originally posted by daycarediva
        This is long-sorry!

        I have a dcb, almost 3/next month and has been potty trained for a good 4-5 months with very infrequent accidents. Yesterday he peed in his pants during AM clean up time, so I sent him to the bathroom to change and the kids finished cleaning up. I thought nothing of it. THEN he did it at PM clean up time. The timing was a little TOO perfect. I held back some toys and he cleaned them up when he was done getting changed.

        Mom way over reacted to his accidents at pick up (imo), even though I said NOTHING about the timing of them. She read over his take home sheet, bent down to dcb and said "Dcb is something bothering you? What happened to make you so upset you wet your pants?" and dcb said "My friends was mean to me!" Mom started to make a fuss over him, so I intervened and asked dcb when his friends were mean and dcb says "They not give me the cars!" and I explained to Mom that dcb has a difficult time sharing the cars and of course his perception of his sharing and those of his friends are quite different, and that the free play incidents and the accidents were spaced far enough apart that the timing was off, kids just have accidents, there doesn't need to be a reason. blah blah She left in a huff, then sent me texts later about it, and his not napping yesterday-or ever-, which I ignored (after hours!)

        This morning she came in, ignored me completely and was all cheery and asked dcb "Now if your friends won't share with you, what are you going to tell them?" and dcb said "My say YOU HAVE TO SHARE FRIENDS!" and dcm smiled sweetly at me and left.

        Today, dcb has had 3 accidents. ALL at times he has to do a non-preferred activity, am clean up, outside clean up and lunch clean up and I am CERTAIN he will have an accident at PM clean up as well.

        After his third accident dcb said "Na-na I no has to clean up!" and ran to the bathroom. I left ALL OF his mess at the table and it was waiting for him when he was done. He threw a MASSIVE fit, tossed his plate on the floor (filled with veggies that he never eats) and tried to go join the other kids on the rug for story time. I redirected dcb back to cleaning up. Since he doesn't nap anyway (whole different story), it was no inconvenience to me to allow unlimited clean up time. I told dcb that as soon as he was finished cleaning up, he could join us. Well, everyone is done with stories, hand washing, pottying, teeth brushing and is asleep and dcb still refuses to touch a single pea or piece of broccoli. They.were.everywhere. I even tried offering to help and he said "I not helping!" I sent him to lay on his nap mat and just cleaned it up myself.

        W T H? How would you handle this kid? Mom?

        He is part time- 2 days per week. Nap issue is that his Mom tells him he doesn't have to sleep, just rest so he wiggles, moves, bothers friends, makes noise, to keep himself awake. Mom prefers he not nap because he falls asleep at 6:30-7 instead of 7:30-8. I do require that he lay QUIETLY on a mat and look at books/quiet toys. Mom disagrees and has TOLD me that she asked around and 'that seems to be the standard of care for kids who aren't comfortable enough to sleep away from home'.
        honestly it sounds like both mom and child are not a good fit for your program

        My DCK DO not have to share. How would that mom feel if she was eating and ice cream cone and you walked up and took a bite out of it. She did say everyone has to share right? UGH.

        I have dc rules that I send home with families when before they start. These rules are for the kids to abide by and for the parents to back. If the parents don't agree with them, they dont attend here.

        I really don't know what to say about the potty accidents. When kids do it on purpose here, I try to ignore it and move on.

        I think that if you are consistent with your method of leaving the mess for him to have to clean up each time and not give in, then he will get it.

        I had a dck age 4 throw all of his green beans on the floor. he took 45 minutes to clean them up. he screamed the whole time saying he hated me and he was not going to. I ignored him and he cleaned it up. He did the same thing two days later and again same thing. He has not done it since then.....

        I wanted to edit to say.....I just realized that he is so part time...I don't think that this kid will ever get it. Not enough of the same routine....
        Last edited by daycare; 06-06-2013, 10:44 AM.

        Comment

        • EntropyControlSpecialist
          Embracing the chaos.
          • Mar 2012
          • 7466

          #5
          Originally posted by Play Care
          Honestly? Today mom would be met with "Sally, I am unable to meet dc boys needs, so I am giving you notice. His last day will be _____."
          Too much work for a PT kid, IMO.
          ABSOLUTELY!!! There is no amount of PART-TIME money that would allow for a Mom to try to dictate rules to me and for me to deal with a child that was this manipulative and seemingly getting worse...

          I do not make my DCKs share, either, and I would have told her that. When they want something another has they say, "DCB, please let me know when you're done!" and whenever that child is done (IF that child is done during our center time) it will be given to that child who asked. If they play with it the entire center time, then they do.

          Comment

          • Unregistered

            #6
            For him, I'm thinking there would be a potty break time right before each clen up. Plus a reminder that Mom is not the maker of rules at daycare. Your home, your rules and he needs to follow them.

            For mom, if it continues she may need a heads up to start seeking alternative care if he is unable to follow the rules & routine at your house.

            Comment

            • Play Care
              Daycare.com Member
              • Dec 2012
              • 6642

              #7
              Oh, and I know some will disagree, but if a child throws something here in a fit, they can pick it up themselves, or I will help them. This means taking them and doing hand over hand assistance. And then they can sit in a time out.

              Comment

              • EntropyControlSpecialist
                Embracing the chaos.
                • Mar 2012
                • 7466

                #8
                Originally posted by Play Care
                Oh, and I know some will disagree, but if a child throws something here in a fit, they can pick it up themselves, or I will help them. This means taking them and doing hand over hand assistance. And then they can sit in a time out.
                I do that, too. In fact I did it this morning.

                Comment

                • daycare
                  Advanced Daycare.com *********
                  • Feb 2011
                  • 16259

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Play Care
                  Oh, and I know some will disagree, but if a child throws something here in a fit, they can pick it up themselves, or I will help them. This means taking them and doing hand over hand assistance. And then they can sit in a time out.
                  ditto....... it does depend on the age though...

                  Comment

                  • daycarediva
                    Daycare.com Member
                    • Jul 2012
                    • 11698

                    #10
                    I see wine in my future tonight. He has been redirected back to his mat at least 10x.

                    I think the bathroom before clean up is a great idea! Will be trying that this afternoon!

                    He is usually ft, mom takes summers off of work & pays his FT rate even though he only attends 2-3 days from June-Sept. She pays/picks up on time, emails me her summer schedule a month in advance, follows every policy to the letter.

                    last summer dcb did great with the transition to pt. This is the first issue I have really ever had with him.

                    Dcm is a helicopter parent who cosleeps, extended bf, but at this point her AP parenting is becoming an excuse for poor behavior.

                    Comment

                    • Patches
                      Daycare.com Member
                      • Dec 2012
                      • 1154

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Play Care
                      Oh, and I know some will disagree, but if a child throws something here in a fit, they can pick it up themselves, or I will help them. This means taking them and doing hand over hand assistance. And then they can sit in a time out.
                      I do this, also

                      Comment

                      • SquirrellyMama
                        New Daycare.com Member
                        • Mar 2012
                        • 554

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Play Care
                        Oh, and I know some will disagree, but if a child throws something here in a fit, they can pick it up themselves, or I will help them. This means taking them and doing hand over hand assistance. And then they can sit in a time out.
                        I do the same thing. I "help" them pick up. It doesn't hurt them for me to hold their hand to pick up. Usually after a few times they will pick up on their own.

                        Although, after the morning you had I probably would have sent him to his nap mat also

                        I also agree with a pp who said her dck's do not have to share. We take turns I found that when I talked about sharing I'd have a dck walk over to a kid who had just picked up a toy and announce they had to "share".

                        Now, I set a timer and they take turns when the timer goes off.

                        I think you need to tell her when his accidents are occurring. I feel for you. I would not want to deal with this mom.

                        K
                        Homeschooling Mama to:
                        lovethis
                        dd12
                        ds 10
                        dd 8

                        Comment

                        • SquirrellyMama
                          New Daycare.com Member
                          • Mar 2012
                          • 554

                          #13
                          Originally posted by daycarediva
                          I see wine in my future tonight.
                          You might need something stronger by the time this day is over :hug:
                          Homeschooling Mama to:
                          lovethis
                          dd12
                          ds 10
                          dd 8

                          Comment

                          • EntropyControlSpecialist
                            Embracing the chaos.
                            • Mar 2012
                            • 7466

                            #14
                            Originally posted by daycarediva
                            I see wine in my future tonight. He has been redirected back to his mat at least 10x.

                            I think the bathroom before clean up is a great idea! Will be trying that this afternoon!

                            He is usually ft, mom takes summers off of work & pays his FT rate even though he only attends 2-3 days from June-Sept. She pays/picks up on time, emails me her summer schedule a month in advance, follows every policy to the letter.

                            last summer dcb did great with the transition to pt. This is the first issue I have really ever had with him.

                            Dcm is a helicopter parent who cosleeps, extended bf, but at this point her AP parenting is becoming an excuse for poor behavior.
                            I totally support AP, but not when it doesn't TRANSITION and GROW with the child. I have ONE AP in my care right now who just can't let go and her 4-year-old child has become wretched because of it. I have another AP in my care and her children are doing exceptionally well because she has adapted it as they grew!

                            I would document each time the child had an accident on a copy of our schedule. I'd put it at the bottom.
                            9:40am Asked to assist in cleaning up toys during clean-up time and had an accident.
                            11:00am Threw food on the floor, was asked to clean it up, and had an accident.
                            etc. etc. etc.

                            Comment

                            • Unregistered

                              #15
                              He would have picked up every piece of food and no,I would not have helped.I will help pick up toys butfood thrown on the floor from a tantrum?!NEVER! He could have taken all day to pick that up for all I care.He could have sat there until his mom came and I would have put it on a plate and saved it for pick up on his next day. As for naps,you alreadyknow what everyone is going to say about that" If he's too old for a nap then he's too old for care" He needs a nap!
                              I agree with the other post about having him go to the bathroom before clean up.

                              Comment

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