Illegally Unlicensed Daycares that Advertise

[Sugar Magnolia]

unregistered....
Um, we are discussing ILLEGALLY OPERATING A CHILD CARE! NO ONE is saying unlicensed is bad. Illegal is bad. It's really not that confusing. Should I get out the dictionary?
Oy Vey!

I agree with blackcat...btw.

[MissSarah]

I just posted this on the town's babysitting facebook site. I'm so frustrated with these people too. I hestitated pressing the "enter" key as this is a small town and alot of people know me. But, enough is enough already. Welcome to my backbone and I may soon claim a "sh*t disturbing" stick too! I also wanted to add that I would report them myself if I know they are doing this (I have already reported 2 of them) but thought that would be a bit much.

To all of the daycare providers who are unlicensed and caring for more than two children who are not related to you:

If you are not aware, you are only legally allowed to care for only two children who are not related. If you care for more than that, then you are running an illegal daycare and you may be fined. The fine is very steep, $10,000 PER DAY that you are out of quota.

I have recently become licensed and have just become aware of this law myself. I just want to give you a heads up so you don't run into trouble with this. See page 57 for more information:
http://www.health.gov.bc.ca/ccf/publ...-licensing.pdf

I think this is a great idea. There may be providers that don't realize they are operating illegally.

I am LEGALLY unlicensed and am very careful to not go over the limit of how many kids I can care for. I did unknowingly come very close to operating illegally though. My province's rules changed in 2011 but I didn't know about it until just a few months ago ....luckily I never did go over the limit...but it was just that...LUCK.

Now I know I need to check the regulations every single year to make sure I'm following the rules. You posting that may help someone who might not realize that they are operating illegally. And if someone has a problem with it, maybe they have something to hide.

[Unregistered]

I am thinking the unregistered poster IS or may be operating illegally.

In MN you can care for children legally unlicensed IF the children are ALL from one family. No limit on the number of kids but they must ALL be from one family.

Sorry, I only AM caring for one family, with 2 kids, so I am going by the book!
I still think this whole subject is ridiculous that you are all complaining about illegal or legal care. At least we all want to care for children and want the best for them.

[Willow]

Sorry, I only AM caring for one family, with 2 kids, so I am going by the book!
I still think this whole subject is ridiculous that you are all complaining about illegal or legal care. At least we all want to care for children and want the best for them.

Illegal care has nothing to do with what is best for children.

Which is why it's illegal

[Cradle2crayons]

I can't answer for the other poster but I know in my state where I am not required to be licensed or registered (Ohio) they would likely require me to do many updates/fence in our very large backyard (over an acre) if I were to become licensed. We really don't have thousands of dollars sitting around to do so. I never want to watch 6 kids at a time (3-4 is more the ratio I enjoy) so to me being licensed would cause more heartache & expense when I am happy to only provide care for 1-2 families at a time not 5 or 6. So for me being licensed seems unnecessary because I have no intention of wanting to have multiple families all at the expense of having the state come & tell me what to do. I do have CPR certification, a college degree & report my income which is very similar to what other local providers charge.

This for me too.

[Blackcat31]

Sorry, I only AM caring for one family, with 2 kids, so I am going by the book!
I still think this whole subject is ridiculous that you are all complaining about illegal or legal care. At least we all want to care for children and want the best for them.

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I wasn't sure since you seem to feel so strongly about illegal providers being able to operate.

However, I would still not hesitate to report someone who was operating illegally.

It is illegal and I could never in good conscience support someone who purposely broke the law just because they feel entitled to do so.

Illegal is illegal no matter how you slice it.

What does wanting best for the children you care for have to do with whether or not you are legally or illegally operating?? :confused:

Wanting the best for children has NOTHING to do with whether or not a provider is licensed or LEGALLY unlicensed.

[Crystal]

I wrote the following post three years ago....and I still feel exactly the same:

When I opened my program 13 years ago, I went through the licensing process. I knew a lady down the street from my home who, at the same time, chose to operate an unlicensed program, which is against regs here in Ca. unless care is only for one family. I chose to mind my own business, I knew her, she seemed like a fine person, as did her (what I thought was) husband, who did some volunteer work for the elementary school that my children were attending. I did lose out on a couple of potential clients, who decided that cheaper was the way to go, but I figure those parents were only thinking about the bottom line, so I probably didn't want them as clients anyway. She ran her business there for about three years, until one day I noticed helicopters flying overhead. This woman, who I never had an issue with, who seemed to be doing all the right things, had alot to hide, hence the reason for not being licensed. The man living in her home had been molesting her daughter (with Mom's knowledge) and had been molesting two three year olds attending her program for some time. He also had several prior felony convictions for drugs and assault charges and the provider herself had done jail time for other offenses. The man is now serving 25 years to life and she did time as well for not preventing it from happening.

I have kicked myself for years over not reporting her unlicensed program to licensing. I COULD have prevented children from being molested, but I chose to "look the other way" because her unlicensed program was "none of my business". In some regard, I have always felt responsible for what occurred in that home.

That being said, of course there are many, many unlicensed programs that go above and beyond. But without that background check, how do we TRULY know that the people operating these programs are who they say they are? Is it a gut instinct that parents should have about the person they are interviewing?

I will NEVER look the other way again. If I EVER come across an unlicensed program, it will immediately be reported, regardless of how clean their home is, how nice they seem to be, or whether or not I "see" any violations other than not having a license. As they say "never judge a book by it's cover" and I think that applies here.

[Unregistered]

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I wasn't sure since you seem to feel so strongly about illegal providers being able to operate.

However, I would still not hesitate to report someone who was operating illegally.

It is illegal and I could never in good conscience support someone who purposely broke the law just because they feel entitled to do so.

Illegal is illegal no matter how you slice it.

What does wanting best for the children you care for have to do with whether or not you are legally or illegally operating?? :confused:

Wanting the best for children has NOTHING to do with whether or not a provider is licensed or LEGALLY unlicensed.

All I was trying to say is that at least, however we as providers run our business, we all love the kids and have chosen to be a daycare provider.

As long as you follow the rules for either way,there should be no one telling us how we should run our daycare as people are trying to say with all these posts.

[Blackcat31]

All I was trying to say is that at least, however we as providers run our business, we all love the kids and have chosen to be a daycare provider.

As long as you follow the rules for either way,there should be no one telling us how we should run our daycare as people are trying to say with all these posts.

I understand what you are trying to say but if a provider is ILLEGALLY operating, how do we KNOW that they are or aren't following the rules and regulations?

If a provider is operating illegally, she isn't subject to unannounced inspections so there is NO way to know that she is or isn't following those guidelines other than her word.

...and I would NEVER take someone's word for something, especially if they were operating illegally because if they are willing to take that risk then their word is definitely not worth much...kwim?

[Sugar Magnolia]

All I was trying to say is that at least, however we as providers run our business, we all love the kids and have chosen to be a daycare provider.

As long as you follow the rules for either way,there should be no one telling us how we should run our daycare as people are trying to say with all these posts.

Now I'm officially DISMAYED! "loving kids" doesn't make illegal daycare ok. Holy Good Grief! Nobody is telling anyone how to run a business! How on earth can you support illegal operation? Seriously?

[Willow]

I am the poster of the original post above this quote, first let me say that I am a former nurse and have had all the training you need to take care of a child,second I have had two children of my own,now have families of their own. I did not need any extra training courses to raise my own kids, I raised them just fine. Do you think that women need to be licensed to raise their own kids? I know that's a loaded question, but seriously, if a women can raise her own children, then why does she need to be licensed to care for others...I know this sounds ridiculous, but it just makes a point.

As far as the licensed daycare home being dirty, no that is not the case with every licensed daycare home, but in turn does that mean that all unlicensed daycare homes are unsafe or dirty ? No, it doesn't.

Some of us unlicensed providers just choose to only care for a few kids and not make it a career, but want to do it because we love the little ones. That does not make us bad people or not responsible. It does cost a lot to be licensed and for just taking a couple kids,from the same family, it is hard for people to afford to do updates on their homes to be licensed for one thing. If you plan on making it a career and have the money to do that , then go for it.

I just don't think it is fair to judge providers for whatever choice they make,whether they are licensed or not and how they advertise. It really is nobody's business on how we conduct our own daycare business, it is up to each provider to as how they do things and their choices. It is hard enough to find kids theses days anyway as many people are losing their jobs, money is tight and they are having to pull their kids out of daycare or look for cheaper ways of finding care.

So lets not nit pic about whether one provider is licensed or not and how they advertise. Initially it is up to parents to choose the right provider for their child and there preferences.

Naw, let's please nitpick some.

I happen to think it's great fun depending on the topic

CPR instruction has changed even in the last 5 years. Certification is only good for a year or two and for very good reason. Science discovers new bits about health and human biology all the time. As a nurse I would expect you to know that?? What was once considered best practice as far as breaths to compressions go is now considered outdated at best, dangerous at worst. You need to stay current if you expect to have the most relevant and best life saving techniques under your belt.

THAT ABSOLUTELY MATTERS TO THE CHILDREN IN ANYONE'S CARE.

When knowing and not knowing is literally a matter of life and death - YES. IT MATTERS.

While it was wonderful I took CPR in high school, what I was taught then is nothing like I'd ever do now. Most people are saved by CURRENT CPR practice than ever before. The reason for that? It's evolved drastically.

So unless you were a former nurse as in a year former, your training is no longer current and what you think you know as correct could in fact at this point be dangerous.



Second - no one is talking about needing a daycare license to raise kids, I have no idea where you're even pulling that from?? The topic is about operating a legal daycare (licensed or non). It's about providing day care for SOMEONE ELSE'S CHILDREN. Not raising. And no one said anything about your own. Heck, no one has said anything about you at all, so it's tough to understand why you keep trying to turn this topic in the direction of your life specifically.

In general, there is a heck of a lot more leeway when discussing what you can and cannot (or should not) do with your own kids as opposed to someone else's. Especially when it comes to the law. Break the law with your own kids, that's your own beef. Break the law with someone else's children and you're talking a whole different ball of wax there.

I don't particularly care if you believe that there is a difference between the two. Bottom line though is *any* illegal activity is just that - ILLEGAL. Whether you think it's for good reason the laws exist or not is moot.


On the mention of dirty homes YOU are the one that brought that up, not me. As if to imply licensed homes are by standard, filthy and the process itself holds no merit.

Basically that all providers that go through the process are morons. I thought it was a ridiculous notion and that's the only reason I addressed it.

When speaking of judgment your post was absolutely steeped in it.


The money thing is geographical and otherwise entirely a matter of perspective. I pay *nothing* for my daycare license unless you count the $50 background check. Everything else involved: my trainings, having a first aide kit, maintaining a safe home, keeping my fire extinguishers in working order etc. - are all things I consider necessary to keeping my own children and family safe anyway. I would do them regardless of daycare licensing protocol.

[SquirrellyMama]

unregistered....
Um, we are discussing ILLEGALLY OPERATING A CHILD CARE! NO ONE is saying unlicensed is bad. Illegal is bad. It's really not that confusing. Should I get out the dictionary?
Oy Vey!

I agree with blackcat...btw.

I think some of the problem is that in some states it is illegal no matter what and other states it is legal to be unlicensed. So, in some posts when the poster says unlicensed in her state that means illegal. Other posters are possibly assuming they are talking about all unlicensed care.

I know the OP specifically stated illegal but others haven't used the word illegal or they had a long post and only used it in the first sentence and then started to just use unlicensed.

This was my mistake in reading some so I'm thinking maybe others did the same thing.

There is a post that starts out saying in their state it is illegal to be unlicensed period but by the time I got to the end I was thinking she was just talking legally unlicensed.

I'm thinking this is why people are defending their legally unlicensed care. Does that make sense?

K

[craftymissbeth]

All I was trying to say is that at least, however we as providers run our business, we all love the kids and have chosen to be a daycare provider.

As long as you follow the rules for either way,there should be no one telling us how we should run our daycare as people are trying to say with all these posts.

operating illegally would most definitely be not following the rules. I'm the OP and I very clearly stated, as did most of the other posters, that I am not against unlicensed provideds, but illegal providers. I'm not trying to be rude, but I don't know how else to say it to get my point across :confused:

[Sugar Magnolia]

And who the heck thinks ALL illegalproviders love kids and are sweethearts? I bet those operating ILLEGALLY are not so awesome, and are fully aware they are breaking the law. It's for.$$$, easy money with no oversight.

[Willow]

All I was trying to say is that at least, however we as providers run our business, we all love the kids and have chosen to be a daycare provider.

As long as you follow the rules for either way,there should be no one telling us how we should run our daycare as people are trying to say with all these posts.

So as long as illicit drug dealers follow the same protocol when dispensing their cocaine as legitimate pharmacists do when dispensing antibiotics they should TOTALLY be considered on the same playing field then.......