4 Year Old Daycare Boy Cries at Dropoff

[Janet]

Drop off tears

I tell the parents as nicely as I possibly can that they make their kids cry more by sticking around and having a long and drawn out goodbye.

[originalkat]

You can explain it in a way they understand.

I tell the parents that the child always feels more powerful and in control when they are with their parents especially with the Mama. When they are at home they are always in the mode of seeking the highest amount of power with their parents.

When they come to day care they are in a group of children so their individual power decreases. They are also not with their main power source: The Mama.

They HAVE to adjust between these two roles very quickly at drop off and pick up. I call it the "changing of the guard". This is when the child goes from them being the one in power to the provider being the one in power at drop off. At pick up it goes from the provider being in control to the child being in control.

If the child acts up at drop off it is a way to continue their power. The higher the escalation the lower the power the child feels in your home. The more they act up at drop off the more oppositional their power is in your care. So for the kids who are REALLY in control at home and really NOT in any kind of control at your house.. you are going to see fireworks of maximus proportions.

This is why I have them deal with it privately. It really IS between them and the child. I'm also offering the parent the opportunity to ONLY knock on my door to have the child come in when the child is READY. If the child does not get to READY then that's something the parent needs to decide and act upon it.

I refuse to play into a game that isn't real. The kid isn't being mistreated in my house. I have a really really good deal here but what I don't have is kids in charge of adults. It doesn't matter how sweet my deal is .. if that's what the kid is after then he will NEVER find that within the walls of my home. If that is the deciding factor of their happiness and the parent isn't going to bring them unless they are happy then it means we have reached the end of our relationship.

At that point I have nothing to loose but to tell the parent that they need to do the "outdoor bye bye plan" and get me completely out of the chaos. They hand me the kid when he is ready and if he is not ever going to be ready then it's time for them to move onto a situation where the kid is happy.

Having them do the good bye in your house.. the "transition" never works because the child remaining in power doesn't work. Some providers try distracting but the wise kid figures out that they only get a distraction for the time it takes to get the parent out the door. Distraction works a little bit for a short amount of time but what the child wants is a higher and higher amount of distractions and promises for distractions well after the parent has left. You end up having to do a dog and pony show in order for the kid to give up their power.

Nan don't play that.

No distractions... no transitional objects... no bargaining... no sympathy... no nuttin. I'm not going to pet an unstable mind set. There are just times in your life where you have to do things you don't want to do. It's okay for the kid to experience that and deal with it. It's not as "good" as being with their power source but it isn't a bad deal.

I have what I have to offer and if that's not what the kid is after they can hurry on down the road.

I totally agree. It is kind of harsh but SOOOOOO true. I dont have this issue right now. All my dck want to be dropped off or at least they arent upset about it. But I do see (especially at pick up) the "changing of the guards" take place. The kids want to exert their power immediatly upon seeing the parent. It manifests itself in different ways for each kid. One bosses her dad and does not want to leave. One tries to get snotty with me even though she would NEVER do that any other time of the day. Another gets loud and crazy and disobeys and she is an angel the rest of the day.
Interesting.

[MarinaVanessa]

If they fuss at drop off I require the parent to do their goodbyes outside on my front porch and then signal me that they are done by knocking on the door. I then open the door and bring the child in WITHOUT the parent following.

This is an interesting method that if I worded a little differently can be explained and not sound harsh at all. Just the same thing about it being a control thing and then just explaining that it's dissruptful of the entire daycare. *sigh* Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to enforce the "you can't come in with them" rule here in CA. A parent here has an "open door" policy and which pretty much means they have the right to come in or drop by unexpectantly during daycare hours and stay for a bit to check things out.

I wonder if I approached it by saying that it will be temporary until the child learns not to cry or fuss and that once they don't cry anymore they can come in again at drop-off if they'll be more open to the idea. I know two moms at least that would feel as though I were telling them they were not welcome to come in. They come in each day and stay for about 15 minutes in the morn also (one breastfeeds, the other stays and chats). I just let them do whatever with their kids since they're little (under a year old) and don't participate with the big kids activities and I go about my business. They know that if it's breakfast and they are with their child and don't put them in their highchairs themselves that they'll miss breakfast. I at least make it clear that I run on a schedule and if they are present then they are still in charge of that child and it is their responsibility that the child is doing what they are supposed to be doing or they miss out.

[nannyde]

This is an interesting method that if I worded a little differently can be explained and not sound harsh at all. Just the same thing about it being a control thing and then just explaining that it's dissruptful of the entire daycare. *sigh* Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to enforce the "you can't come in with them" rule here in CA. A parent here has an "open door" policy and which pretty much means they have the right to come in or drop by unexpectantly during daycare hours and stay for a bit to check things out.

I wonder if I approached it by saying that it will be temporary until the child learns not to cry or fuss and that once they don't cry anymore they can come in again at drop-off if they'll be more open to the idea. I know two moms at least that would feel as though I were telling them they were not welcome to come in. They come in each day and stay for about 15 minutes in the morn also (one breastfeeds, the other stays and chats). I just let them do whatever with their kids since they're little (under a year old) and don't participate with the big kids activities and I go about my business. They know that if it's breakfast and they are with their child and don't put them in their highchairs themselves that they'll miss breakfast. I at least make it clear that I run on a schedule and if they are present then they are still in charge of that child and it is their responsibility that the child is doing what they are supposed to be doing or they miss out.

I don't know how your State regs read but could you be taking the "open door" policy a little further than it's intent? My State requires us to give immediate access to the child and the provider at any time. It doesn't require us to allow parents to hang out and watch us take care of kids. It doesn't require providers to allow parents to care for their own children under our roof. It doesn't allow parents to have access to the OTHER day care kids.

I do all arrivals and departures at the front door so having them do a week or so of arrivals at the front step is only a foot away LOL. The parents stay in the front entryway every day. I would NEVER allow a parent to come and breastfeed at drop off. I would never allow a parent to hang out for 15 minutes every day with their child. The Mom could feed her kid at home or provde breast milk for that feeding. The Dad you have that hangs out can simply spend another fifteen minutes of one to one time with his own child in his own house.

I like my day care parents and I'm fortunate enough to have a helper to be with the kids when they come to pick up every day. I offer them the conferencing they need to share info or stories about their kid. I have communication with them throughout the day so they know about the biggies and any glitches.

Every day is different but most will spend a few minutes at each end and just touch base. Some day it is a quick drop off and pick up and some days it's a little longer. I average about 60-70 minutes a day doing arrivals and departures when I have eight kids. I already do a significant amount of time every day visiting with them. I don't want to do anymore.

One thing I learned years ago was that I didn't want the parents caring for their kids under my roof. I have safety rules in place that they would not comply to with their own children. I don't like the liability of them making decisions on my property.

I had this one Dad years ago who was a really neat guy and had a WILD toddler. They were with me for about a year. Every day he would drop off or pick up the kid would be flailing in his arms and he would let her down in my living room at the front door. My living room is NOT child proofed for a reason. There is nothing in my livingroom for the kids. I have a couch, two tables and a TV. That's it. Other than outlet covers there is no sign of day care in my living room.

So as soon as he puts her down I pick her back up and hand her back. I tell him... oh no this room is not safety proofed. She can't be down on the floor here. He would say "oh she's allright". NO .. I'm not alright with it. I don't want kids in my living room. There are no toys... nothing but the tv to get into, the couch to crawl up on, and the table to crawl up on.

One day he locked his keys in his car and I got stuck with him and the kid while he waited for the Mom to come with the spare set. I was off the clock at that time but I offered for him to use one of my empty playrooms as long as he kept her on the side of the room that she was allowed on. I show him exactly the line that she can't cross. "this side is for her... this side is NO". The side he did have for her was TWO HUNDRED square foot. He takes her back there and within ten seconds she was on the side of the room that was for the adults. UGH... again he says she's fine, he's watching her, she's okay.

NO she's not fine. She's in an area I don't ever let her play in. She's trained not to go into that area and it's NOT SAFE. I have baby equipment on that side that was just cleaned for the next day and paperwork set up for the next day. The kid could cause me an hour with of work in a few minutes.

I booted them out and told him to take her to the park around the corner. I gave him a fresh diaper, wipes, and a cup of juice and out the door they went.

The Dad didn't have ANY problem allowing her to play with and on top of an exersaucer designed for infants. He didn't have any problem with her playing with the infant toys which I don't allow here. He didn't have any problem with her climbing on the gate. He was cool with it.. but I was not.

No parents taking care of kids in my house.

[My4SunshineGirlsNY]

I think I need to toughen up...the mom of the boy was running a little behind this morning....instead of greeting the boy at the door like I normally do (and he just clings to his mom and gives a whine when I try to talk him into playing with playdough or coloring), I sat at my kitchen table with my other daycare boy and was playing with the playdough with him.

I did say Hi to the boy and how are you today?...he didn't answer, just clung to his mom (she carries him in), and I continued to just play with my other daycare boy. I briefly told the mom that he only does that when she's here, once she leaves he's fine. She then put him down, said I have to go I'm running late...he's crying on the floor, woke my daughter up...GRRR I was so upset because she's one that NEEDS her rest!! He tried to follow his mom out the door and she had to push him back in and shut the door.

Not even 2 min. later he was quiet and fine...from now on, I'm going to let her deal with the drop off situation. Every time I try to excite him about the day, he just whines and clings to his mom..funny he's fine as can be and has fun here after mom leaves.

[momma2girls]

I don't let pick ups or drop offs a long drawn out deal at all. I would never allow a Mom to breastfeed here!!!
You definately need to say something to her!!! Just say I really cannot have you breastfeeding here, I have many parents dropping off at the same time. Please do this at home before leaving!!!! Hope this helps!!!!

[MarinaVanessa]

I don't mind if mom wants to breastfeed here or not. At drop off when the other mom likes to stay for a couple of minutes I don't mind either. Her kids are here part time and wants to see what they are doing. I'm ok with it as long as leaving time isn't drawn out. That's great that not allowing parents to come in works for some of you and their families unfortunately that wouldnt work for me or the families that I care for. If I were a parent that had a child in daycare and the provider didn't want me coming inside then that daycare and my needs wouldn't be a good fit. In my area I don't know any providers that don't allow families to come into their daycares so if I or another provider did this I don't think that it'll be welcomed or appealing by the families that live in my area. I am following what I have been told by licensing and go further by putting a 15 minute time-cap on it. When I had my daughter in daycare a few years back I was told the same thing by that provider.

[Daycare Mommy]

The ones that just stand there talking your ear off are really annoying. I'm not talking about 5 minutes or less. I have one that does 20-30 minutes. Like "Hel-LO! I'm working!" I can understand the breastfeeding mother though. It buys her more time to breastfeed at the very last moment before going to work. If it takes her 20 minutes to get from her house to daycare (including loading and unloading the baby) then she has that much more time before pumping again. It's like a race against the clock when leaving your breastfed baby anywhere. BTDT! My hat is off to the mommies that work and breastfeed. It is NOT an easy feat to pull off, so I did my best to accomodate them back when I did infant care. I let them use a rocking chair in one of my bedrooms for privacy.

[Greenshadow]

The little girl that was throwing a fit when her mom drops her off seems to throw her fit on Mondays and is fine the rest of the week. She tried to wimper alittle today but her mom just said that she would be back later and left. The little girl was fine. So I think alot of the issues with it with this particular girl is that she has had mom all weekend and its back to real life now on Mondays. LOL.

Side note: I dont mind moms coming to talk for a few minutes. If it makes them feel comfortable and its not interfering in what Im doing, Im okay with it. Pick up time is free play for us anyway so if mom wants to talk for a few mins, Im okay with it. I dont think I'd want her to sit around and breastfeed while she is here though. I feel that should be done elsewhere. Im not against it at all but this is my home and my job and theres a time and a place for everything.

[KIDZRMYBIZ]

Resurrecting a very old thread. Need help.

I have a new 5yo DCB. He is having a little trouble adjusting, for 2 reasons: 1)previous daycare was free-play all day and I am structured (quite an adjustment) and 2)previous daycare required DCB to lay down for 2.5 period and I do not nap my 4&5yos (I think he's getting overtired).

DCB needs my environment. He is way, way, way behind, and in no way ready for Kindergarten this August yet. It's the biggest reason for the daycare switch.

DCB is being SUPER clingy with DCM at drop-off. I can tell this DCM is not going to appreciate me intervening, and I have tried to let her get this under control, but it has become ridiculous. Today is his 6th day with us. DCM was here for a little over 15 mins this morning, which is an eternity for a drop-off. It is time for me to stop this, right now! I am going to have to insist on the "Bye-Bye Outside" routine.

I love the bye-bye outside routine! It is 100% effective! I've been trying to piece together an e-mail for DCM with this thread, but can't find the right words to explain the "reasoning" for the method, without making the DCM bristle. I know she isn't going to like this, but what's happening now is too disruptive. How would you state it?

[Heidi]

I have a new 5yo DCB. He is having a little trouble adjusting, for 2 reasons: 1)previous daycare was free-play all day and I am structured (quite an adjustment) and 2)previous daycare required DCB to lay down for 2.5 period and I do not nap my 4&5yos (I think he's getting overtired).

DCB needs my environment. He is way, way, way behind, and in no way ready for Kindergarten this August yet. It's the biggest reason for the daycare switch.

DCB is being SUPER clingy with DCM at drop-off. I can tell this DCM is not going to appreciate me intervening, and I have tried to let her get this under control, but it has become ridiculous. Today is his 6th day with us. DCM was here for a little over 15 mins this morning, which is an eternity for a drop-off. It is time for me to stop this, right now! I am going to have to insist on the "Bye-Bye Outside" routine.

I love the bye-bye outside routine! It is 100% effective! I've been trying to piece together an e-mail for DCM with this thread, but can't find the right words to explain the "reasoning" for the method, without making the DCM bristle. I know she isn't going to like this, but what's happening now is too disruptive. How would you state it?

I wouldn't advise going right to that extreme.

I don't know who I adopted this from anymore, but here is my policy. Feel free to take any of it you want:

Transition Times:

Once a child is comfortable in childcare, we sometimes start to see some challenging behaviors at morning and afternoon transition times. This is sometimes called the “changing of the guard”.

Here are some ways we can help your child with that:

Keep goodbyes brief. If you have established a morning ritual, stick to it, but keep it short & sweet. As they say, sometimes “less is more”. Please be assured that I can handle any situation, and will be happy to send you a picture of your child happily playing shortly afterwards if that helps.

At the end of the day, please feel free to come in and hang out for a while. Let your child show you some things she’s done today, or sit down and read a book. Your child has missed you, and would a few minutes of your full attention will do wonders for her mood .

If there are things we need to discuss, and your child appears anxious to go, please feel free to call me after hours (6-8 pm works best).

Your child may want to see if the “rules” still apply when parents are here. They do! Please, do not be offended if I remind your child of a rule. Your child will feel comfort and confidence knowing that the people that care for her are all on the same team. Should you need to discipline your child in my presence, please be assured that I will “back you up” as well.

Please remember that once you have arrived and acknowledged your child (or before they are signed in at arrival), you are responsible for the safety of your child. Children should not be allowed to run freely in the unfenced yard or around vehicles, or be allowed to stand on furniture, etc., during these times.

I print it out, give it to her, and ask her to give you a call in the evening to work out some strategies together; to make things easier for DCB.

IF that doesn't work, you can go to bye bye outside.

[KIDZRMYBIZ]

Thanks, Heidi. I used your idea, and even a few of your lines. I suggested making sure he wasn't tired, then acting cheerful about coming, then making the good-bye short and sweet in the front hall, and letting me take it from there. If it doesn't improve within a few days, then I will insist on the "bye-bye outside."

It is just so painful to watch a dramatic, tearful exchange as they try to tear themselves from one another, and the DCM not be able to summon an ounce of authority. It's a disruptive spectacle we can all do without!

[Heidi]

Thanks, Heidi. I used your idea, and even a few of your lines. I suggested making sure he wasn't tired, then acting cheerful about coming, then making the good-bye short and sweet in the front hall, and letting me take it from there. If it doesn't improve within a few days, then I will insist on the "bye-bye outside."

It is just so painful to watch a dramatic, tearful exchange as they try to tear themselves from one another, and the DCM not be able to summon an ounce of authority. It's a disruptive spectacle we can all do without!

Yeah, my darling 2 year old here did the same thing for about 2 weeks. She has been with me since she was 6 weeks old, so it wasn't about being in a new place. She totally had mom wrapped around that pinky.

I've known mom long enough now that I could just say "Go" in an authoritative voice after a couple days of gently trying to convince her that it would be okay. Then, I snapped a picture of dcg hanging up her coat before mom was even out of the driveway (texted it to her, of course).

It took a few more days of that, me peeling her off mom, setting her on the bench, and telling her to come play when she was ready (and my dh saying "Squirrel!"), and she is over it. ::