DCG May Have Broke My Sons Nose..Now What?

[missnikki]

Aw, poor guy. It's always sadder when someone gets hurt having fun and being good. Your son sounds like a wonderful person for being so loving and helpful, I'm sorry he had to get hurt.
As for the little girl, I'd bet my bottom dollar that you used this as a 'teachable moment' with her, and that she will remember the pain that happens when you play too rough. That's a valuable lesson to learn- so valuable, it cost your son comfortable use of his nose for a while, bless his heart.

[Crystal]

Now don't be silly. I'm sure she needs a male figure in her life and nobody would think anything of a big brother doing the same thing!

hahaha...my husband would never wrestle around on the bed with a child.

[dEHmom]

Let me re-phrase, if your child got hit in the face in gym class, would you expect the school to pay the bill?

I don't know how the school systems work in the USA, but here, I'm positive we sign a waiver that releases the school for responsibility for pretty much everything. Except maybe if they lost the child, or something that is CLEARLY the fault of the school. But if a child gets punched in the face by another kid, the school is not responsible for the cost of anything.

In most of our daycare contracts I also believe much of the same is in order. I have a section regarding medical emergencies, and even though health care and all that is free in Canada, if you have to call an ambulance, and your insurance doesn't cover you, you are footing the bill for the ambulance. My contract states that parents are responsible for any and all medical expenses incurred. Should it be due to neglect on my part in any way, then I would be responsible. SO......IF i let a child sit there and drink a bottle of lysol, well, that is clearly my fault! Should a child fall off the slide and chip a tooth, I am not responsible. I'm sure you get the drift.

Also, there is insurance for such things. I don't know how it works for your own children, but I know if lets say someone else was hurt on your property and they sued you for the cost of medical bills, you are insured up to whatever your liability coverage is. The parents of this girl left her in your care. You've assumed all responsibility for whatever happens in your home, with this girl, for the contracted hours. Unfortunately it was an accident. I would be fuming too! I have a 2 yr old of my own, and sometiems I just don't understand what is going through his head! But, I don't think you have any grounds to have them pay for anything. Unless she intentionally took the piggy bank and attacked him.

[Blackcat31]

Wow, legomom I am so sorry for your son. I'm sure a broken nose is horrible and for a 15 yr old, how embarrassing. I hope he is okay.

I will share a similar story about my own DS. When he was about 6 my DS and another dcb were outside playing and my DS comes inside and says tome, "Mom, John hurt my finger" and he holds up his hand so I can see his right index finger. I look and it looks a little red on top but then I notice a drop of blood fall onto the floor and I say, "Let me see the other side of your hand" He shows me and I about lost it!! His finger bone was sticking out about 2 inches and the finger was split right open and looked like it was blown open in an explosion! I got so dizzy and faint like...my DS meanwhile is just standing there calm as could be (in shock, I'm sure). So anyways, I luckily had my assistant there with me that day and she stayed and closed the daycare while I rushed my DS to the ER. Long story short...we were transported 85 miles away to have emergency surgery by a pediatric orthopedic surgeon in the middle of the night. (We had no one qualified in my town). Well, after staying in the hospital over night with my son and not sleeping a wink, I drove home the next day and opened up daycare as normal. My son ended up having 2 pins placed in his knuckle and 8 months of bi-weekly physical therapy. His finger is still only 85% normal.
The parents of the son who was involved in the incident with my kid came to daycare for a week or two afterwards, but eventually told me that they felt so bad about the whole thing that they just could'nt have their son in daycare any more. The had Grandma watch him. It wasn't that he was a bad kid because he wasn't. He was really good and sort of shy and quiet (whole family was). They just were so stressed over the fact that accidents can happen that they couldn't take it. I found out years later when my DS was in high school with John that he (John) wasn't allowed to play sports because his parents were so worried someone could get hurt. I felt so bad that this family was so freaked out by the possibility of accidental injuries that it limited their lives. I could tell horror stories about my youth and the things we got hurt doing or could have gotten hurt while doing.

I think that things do happen and sometimes no matter how cautious we are or how prepared we are, stuff still happens. Some times we are the victims and sometimes we are the cause but either way I think the main thing is intention and there was no intention of hurting anyone so it is just unfortuante that it happened. I would feel a bit angry if I were you as well but I would honestly just feel that way for a bit and then be fine. I wouldn't expect the other family to do anything beside apologize and feel sympathetic to your son. Even apologizing is just a coutesy since even they can't control their DD behaviors, especially not when they aren't even with her.

Good wishes for a speedy recovery to your son and I hope there is no lasting permanent damage.

[jen]

Providers definitely are responsible for the bill in these situations. When an incident occurs, the parents aren't even supposed to know who the other child is that was involved so I don't see how anyone could think otherwise.

I wasn't going to disagree with you on this, because I figured it would cause the great debate. But...I changed my mind! ::

Daycare providers are NOT immediately liable for every accident, injury or illness that occurs at daycare.

Personally, I have a liability waiver in my contract as I assume most providers do. My sister is a lawyer and we discussed my contract and my liability at lenghth. In order to be held liable, a parent would need to prove neglect on the part of the provider.

Scenario 1: Little Jimmy is playing in the backyard, trips over his feet, bonks his head and requires stitches. Providing that the caregiver met all of the safety and supervision requirements he/she wouldn't be liable for medical bills.

Yes, the parents can attempt to sue for them; however, they are unlikely to a) find an attorney willing to take the case as the reward (based on the attorney collecting 1/3 of the settlement + expenses) won't be worth it,

b)If the parent pays the attorney his billable rate, it will far exceed the amount of the stitches and while you may loose the client, it is cheaper for the parent to simply pay the bill or,

c) if they take you to small claims, unless they can prove neglect, they will loose per the above contract.

Now if Little Jimmy falls off the swingset and the provider doesn't have the appropriate fall zone depth, you can prove neglect and now the providers liability insurance is a God-send.

In this case, the provider would be negligent by my county licensing laws as the child was not being supervised by the caregiver or a back-up provider over the age of 18 and also because the "toy" was inappropriate.

[marniewon]

I will share a similar story about my own DS. When he was about 6 my DS and another dcb were outside playing and my DS comes inside and says tome, "Mom, John hurt my finger" and he holds up his hand so I can see his right index finger. I look and it looks a little red on top but then I notice a drop of blood fall onto the floor and I say, "Let me see the other side of your hand" He shows me and I about lost it!! His finger bone was sticking out about 2 inches and the finger was split right open and looked like it was blown open in an explosion! I got so dizzy and faint like...my DS meanwhile is just standing there calm as could be (in shock, I'm sure).

Wow Blackcat - how in the world does something like that happen? I can imagine how you felt, I got a little sick feeling just reading about it!! Several years ago I was in nursing school, loving it, looking forward to my new career. Then my son broke his arm. I took him to the ER and while we were waiting for the doc I called my dh to come to the hospital (don't even remember why now). By the time dh got there I was feeling so sick that I had him sit with ds so I could go to the restroom and splash cold water on my face, sit down (so as not to pass out) and basically regroup. And that was over a simple break - no blood, no guts, no seeing the bone or anything. Needless to say, that was my last semester of nursing school

[DBug]

I'm so sorry your son got hurt! Sounds like it's time for lots of pain killers and video games

Like PP, I just have to add my two cents here, for what it's worth ...

I think you need to be very careful about allowing your son to be in compromising situations like letting him wrestle with any daycare child (let alone a girl) on his bed! If any accusations were to come out of it, it could ruin his reputation and even his life. Even being accused of any form of abuse could damage his chances of getting a job, etc.

Even if the parents of this child would never accuse him of anything, what if another daycare parent, neighbour or friend of your son's heard about it and reported it?

I have two sons too, and even though they're not teenagers yet, I'm very careful about the situations I allow them to be in. Because it doesn't always matters what IS happening -- it matters what people THINK might be happening.

[QualiTcare]

hahaha...my husband would never wrestle around on the bed with a child.

i said "big brother" referring to the important role of males in daycare - who are not always husbands.

[QualiTcare]

I wasn't going to disagree with you on this, because I figured it would cause the great debate. But...I changed my mind! ::

Daycare providers are NOT immediately liable for every accident, injury or illness that occurs at daycare.

Personally, I have a liability waiver in my contract as I assume most providers do. My sister is a lawyer and we discussed my contract and my liability at lenghth. In order to be held liable, a parent would need to prove neglect on the part of the provider.

Scenario 1: Little Jimmy is playing in the backyard, trips over his feet, bonks his head and requires stitches. Providing that the caregiver met all of the safety and supervision requirements he/she wouldn't be liable for medical bills.

Yes, the parents can attempt to sue for them; however, they are unlikely to a) find an attorney willing to take the case as the reward (based on the attorney collecting 1/3 of the settlement + expenses) won't be worth it,

b)If the parent pays the attorney his billable rate, it will far exceed the amount of the stitches and while you may loose the client, it is cheaper for the parent to simply pay the bill or,

c) if they take you to small claims, unless they can prove neglect, they will loose per the above contract.

Now if Little Jimmy falls off the swingset and the provider doesn't have the appropriate fall zone depth, you can prove neglect and now the providers liability insurance is a God-send.

In this case, the provider would be negligent by my county licensing laws as the child was not being supervised by the caregiver or a back-up provider over the age of 18 and also because the "toy" was inappropriate.

well, you're not really disagreeing with me. this scenario is a perfect example. usually when two kids are involved and one gets injured the provider will be found responsible because no matter how "impossible" it might seem, they coulda, woulda, shoulda been able to prevent it.

[jen]

well, you're not really disagreeing with me. this scenario is a perfect example. usually when two kids are involved and one gets injured the provider will be found responsible because no matter how "impossible" it might seem, they coulda, woulda, shoulda been able to prevent it.

LOL...nope, I am definitely disagreeing with you!

[Crystal]

i said "big brother" referring to the important role of males in daycare - who are not always husbands.

you're cute

[QualiTcare]

LOL...nope, I am definitely disagreeing with you!

well, you can disagree for the sake of disagreeing, but i said the provider would be reponsible in this case and you said the same thing. i guess it depends on your definition of agreeing.

btw, waivers and disclaimers are rarely worth the paper they're written on. it's a misconception that having someone sign a paper keeps them safe, but you can't sign away your legal rights nor the rights of your child.

[jen]

well, you can disagree for the sake of disagreeing, but i said the provider would be reponsible in this case and you said the same thing. i guess it depends on your definition of agreeing.

Actually, you didn't say "in this case" you said "When an incident occurs, the parents aren't even supposed to know who the other child is that was involved so I don't see how anyone could think otherwise."

My point being, when an incident occurs, it is NOT the providers responsibility to pay the medical bills unless the provider was negligent and the parent can prove it. In this individual case, the provider was negligent.

My point being, had two children been playing, in full view of the provider, and Child A accidentally hit Child B, with an age appropriate toy, the provider would NOT be negligent or responsible for any medical care required.

Your post led me to believe that you think that anytime a child is injured at daycare and requires medical attention, that the provider is liable. That is the issue to which I take exception.

[jen]

btw, waivers and disclaimers are rarely worth the paper they're written on. it's a misconception that having someone sign a paper keeps them safe, but you can't sign away your legal rights nor the rights of your child.

Yes, waivers and disclaimers don't amount to jack if you are negligent.

In addition, many things, especially the seriousness of the injury, influence to what extent liability becomes an issue. As for the rest, you'll forgive me if I take the word of an actual board certified attorney, right?

Now, can you just agree to disagree?

[JenNJ]

I'm sorry he is in pain, that stinks!

I agree with the others who said the parent is NOT responsible, YOU are.

I also agree 100% with Crystal in that I would never, ever, ever allow ANY dc child to be in my child's bedroom, no matter how old they are. I don't let my dc kids in my 4 yr old or 2 yr olds bedrooms. I really would not allow my teenage child to be playing in a bedroom with a dc child EVER.

My husband is frequently home with my kids and the dc kids. He plays with them and rough houses with them each time he is home. I (and my clients) consider him a male role model. I would never allow my dc kids to wrestle on the bed with him, EVER. I trust my husband 10000000%. But I am not going to take the chance that an innocent act could be perceived wrong.

In daycare, it is all about perception. All of us, as providers, are constantly being judged on every word you say, face you make, and crumb on your floor. Our homes and families are under a microscope each day as they should be. Just reading the following sent red flags flying in my head.

but DCG 2.5, was playing with my almost 15 yr old DS. He was laying on his bed and she was climbing and jumping on him etc.

No matter how great your son is, it is inappropriate to have her in his bed.