MN Budget Shutdown....

[jojosmommy]

Mn is facing a budget shutdown July 1. Basically we will not be getting paid for assistance clients until the budget is resolved. Also, we MAY NEVER get paid for clients on assistance during the shutdown and have recieved this in writing from our assistance proivder/dhs. Basically, if you are a provider and you CHOOSE to continue to have the kids at daycare you may not get paid for the days they are there while the shutdown is in progress. The state may decide after the shutdown to fairly pay providers for services rendered during that time but that is unclear. After the shutdown and the budget is resolved you will continue to get payments for assistance clients starting after the budget is resolved.

So, do you continue to keep the kids in care with the hope that the state will quickly resolve the budget AND decide to pay for services during the intermediate time OR do you tell the families they have to make other arrangements and to what extreme do you do that? Do you encourage/require them to pay for daycare on their own (which in many cases is out of their budget) or do you tell them the kids can not come to care until the budget is resolved and thus never have a chance at making money during that time (can't bill the state for time they arent here even IF the state decides to pay providers for that in between time).

Its not relaistic in this area to fill the space with someone else- less than two weeks time to do so. So basically I am faced with the choice to provide care (which may be free thanks to the state of MN) or have less kids during the shutdown and a lot less $ also.

I have 4 kids on assistance of the total 6 kids I have in care. Mom has already said she can not pay for all the daycare costs and has asked her job for a temporary leave if need be.

What would you do? Help!?

[squareone]

Ouch, that's a tough one. At first thought, I would send a letter to parents informing them that effective two weeks from today, you will be temporarily suspending care from state paid clients until you get a guarantee from the government that you will be paid. Give the parents the option to pay out-of-pocket (most probably won't be able to) and tell them you will reimburse them if and when you get paid from the state. Let them know that you love your job but you cannot afford to do it for free. Start interviewing for self-pay clients immediately.

If you decide to continue care, offer bare-bones, basic care. Have the parents supply EVERYTHING so that you have as little overhead as possible. Suspend your participation in the food program and have the parents provide all meals, drinks and snacks. If you supply diapers and wipes have the parents bring them, etc, etc. Suspend any paid curriculum programs that you use and and use free ones from the internet, make free crafts and have parents donate recycable materials like empty paper towel rolls, cereal boxes, scrap paper,etc for crafts. Suspend paid field trips and just walk to the neighborhood playground, nature walks,etc. Let parents know that you regret having to do this but if you work together, everyone can get through this and regular services will resume when the state budget is resovled.

[GretasLittleFriends]

I got the same letter you did. Right now I only have one child on assistance. I'm fairly certain the mother got a similar letter in the mail, though I haven't yet asked.

I plan to talk to her about it tomorrow evening. What I am proposing is that she pay out of pocket from July 1 until the budget resolution. I will be willing to set up a payment plan for her if necessary. Meaning if she can only afford FOR EXAMPLE $50 a week and I say charge $100 a week. She can pay me $50 a week even after the budget is balanced and her balance with me is taken care of.

If we are lucky and if the state does allow back pay to the providers for those clients on assistance, I will then reimburse her the amount she paid me during that time.

Like I said, I only have one client on assistance, but would do this for all of them if I had more.

[Meeko]

Oh my goodness...what a mess!

Typical government.....I am sure those at the top will not be losing one penny in pay or benefits.....

You really are between a rock and hard place with this problem.

If it were me, I would go on tending the children and hope and pray that the state gets its rear in gear and takes care of the problem. It's not ideal...but I can't see any decent alternatives that won't hurt even more.

Your only other choice is to charge the parents (impossible for some to pay, I know) or let them go. Terming is hard for all. You still end up with no money and the mom could lose her job if she doesn't show up. No other provider is going take a child she isn't going to get paid for.

Good luck with this. My heart just aches for you....it's a terrible situation.

Most importantly.....I would also get together with as many day care providers as you can and bombard the state with letters, calls and e-mails SEVERAL TIMES A DAY. " Get others active!

"When am I going to get paid?"
"Where's my money"?
"I want to speak to a supervisor" etc.....etc.....etc.....day in and day out until it changes.

Contact local papers and tell them your story. Contact your state leaders. Get the parents to call and write too. The kids are ultimately going to suffer if their parents lose their jobs because they can't find day care. Kids are going to suffer if day care providers can't make a living and close down.

State admin don't like the public knowing about their less than savory decisions....especially if it involves children. I would not be shy about exploiting that angle and shaming your state leaders.

If you all just grin and take it, they will assume it's OK to do this. Make yourselves such a pain in the neck that they will want to solve things as soon as possible.

Good luck.....I'm cheering for you!

[MarinaVanessa]

That's been happening here in CA for the last few years. Any time that the budget isn't approved on time subsidy checks are late and sometimes reduced. I don't know if you can do this or not but this is what we do here when this happens.

(assuming that you will continue to be paid by subsity until July 1st)
Give your families a written notice with a choice of either

a) Beginning July 1st they pay you out of pocket to continue childcare services in your daycare and reimburse the parents back once you get your subsidy checks. Any money that subsidy doesn't pay they are still responsible for so for example if you are owed $600 for a family one month but because of budget cuts subsidy only sends you a $500 check then you reimburse the family only $500. Or ...

b) Their care is suspended as of July 1st (your notice if given now will serve as your notice of termination) and you will begin advertising to fill their spot. If the budget matter gets resolved quickly and subsidy reimbursements aren't changed and you have not filled their spot then they are welcome to come back.

Last year it was so bad here that providers didn't get checks for several months and programs that parents were on got cut or terminated so providers that did eventually get checks lost out on 15% of what they were supposed to get and some that were on the programs that were terminated were never paid at all. Last year I wasn'y affected because I didn't have clients on subsidy at that time. Once the budget was approved one of my clients went on subsidy and this year I'm prepared for it. Good luck and hopefully it's not too bad for you.

[Blackcat31]

Yes, ALL families receiving assistance and childcare providers (whether they have families on assistance or not) recieved letters stating what will happen during the potential state shut down late last week.

I sent out notice to all the families I currently have receiving CCAP services earlier in the month. I was aware of the possible shut-down and it's effects through an e-mail from the state in the beginning of June. (I would advise all providers in MN to suscribe to e-mail notification of changes. You can do this at the MN DHS website.) It helps get the heads up on things early.

The notice I sent to my families on CCAP lets them know of the up coming shut-down. The solutions I offered to them are that they can continue to attend childcare IF:
*we construct a temporary contract stating that they are aware they will need to cover ALL expenses NOT covered by the state and agree to a specific time line for paying for their services during this time. (These are individual contracts between myself and each family) and that they agree to
*use the bare minimum for work or school hours ONLY

If they wish to take an extended leave of absence, then I will consider June 30th as their 2 week notice and I will begin to fill spaces from my wait list as needed to maintain my own financial needs. Payment for the final notice will need to be spelled out in a payment plan as well.

I fully understand the difficulty this will make for some of these families but as I always stress to all families, I need to continue to do what works best for ME and my business.

Let's all just hope a resolution will happen before a shut-down does occur.

[jojosmommy]

Thanks for all the support! I think its fair to say pay or go away however I am in a really tight spot right now as this family has 4 kids (SURPRISE!) and pays nothing for daycare now so I know they would never be able to pay me the thousands it would be for care per month if I asked out of pocket.

Also, this family is leaving me September 1 anyway (and has been more than fair about giving me notice) as most of the kids are going to be in school. I am sort-of filling their space with a family starting back after maternity late aug. Plus I will have my own in October so I was really hoping to hold on to this family until sept 1 (and their money) and then take it a little easier once our own is born. I did not however plan to be done with them this soon. All my other families went pt this summer- which I allowed mostly b/c I am preggo and wanted an easier summer. I shouldn't have painted myself into the corner but I guess you never know what is going to happen until it does.


I don't want to post ads for a temp position for the summer for 1 or 2 kids when I would rather take this family back once the budget is resolved. They have super easy hours and a number of days this summer I am working 9-3:30::. I know that wouldn't be the case with another family.

Well, I think I will talk to mom tonight about it and see if she will keep sending them on a super PT basis so that IF the budget gets worked out I still get paid some of what I would have made and if not I am not totally inconvienced by them being here and not getting paid. I will talk to her about a payment plan and let her know I will pay her back IF/when I get reimbursed by the state.

If anyone has any other ideas let me know.

We also just got info from our food program saying that the money is quarenteed however payments will be delayed if state workers are laidoff as nobody will be available to process the payments.

[MarinaVanessa]

I don't want to post ads for a temp position for the summer for 1 or 2 kids when I would rather take this family back once the budget is resolved. They have super easy hours and a number of days this summer I am working 9-3:30::. I know that wouldn't be the case with another family.

Well then just notify them (always, ALWAYS in writing) that you will play it by ear. If there is a shutown it'll take time to get there so maybe you will only miss out on some money, if any.
KUP.

[MN Day Mom]

I'm also in Minnesota, however I do not have any families on assistance and I also did not get a letter.

All that said... if I did have families on assistance I would do whatever I could to allow them to keep working and allow their children to remain with me. I would have confidence that I would get reimbursed after the budget is resolved. I would probably work out a new temporary contract with them asking for a good faith payment of some sort during the shut down which I would reimburse when the state got caught up with me (which I believe they will do)

[Blackcat31]

http://www.dhs.state.mn.us/main/idcplg?IdcService=GET_DYNAMIC_CONVERSION&RevisionSelectionMethod=LatestReleased&dDocName=dhs16_162264

If any one needs information.

[SimpleMom]

To be honest, I would only do it if the parents paid me during the time of the shutdown. They could ask the state to reimburse them if they wanted to after that. Otherwise, you are pretty much working for free and that's just not right--unless you can and want to volunteer to care for them during that time.

[Cat Herder]

Sorry to hear about that.

IMHO, I would have to let them go.

They have already received more financial help than I ever have and feel it is unfair for them to expect for me to give them more.

Daycare is not a charity.

[laurasophia]

Unbelievable!

If I was the client of any of you providers who are going off about YOUR income and YOUR life, I would NEVER return my kids to your care!! Is it me or ? Don't most people expect the people who do childcare to be primarily concerned for children? NOT $$$$$!! These families are already (obviously) needing help BEFORE shutdown or they wouldn't be receiving childcare assistance! And now they will likely have to choose between a job or no job because you providers won't care for their children for the interim? UNBELIEVABLE!!

To the person who said her clients have already received more help than (s)he ever has: SHAME ON YOU!! You are obviously biased and prejudiced and resentful!! I don't believe for one second you don't "look" at those children differently than the other "private-pay" children. And if YOU are being paid....if YOUR name is on that payment for childcare....then I put it to you that YOU are also a beneficiary of the assistance!! If you want to be so high and mighty, refuse to care for children who are recipients of childcare assistance!

With the exception of the ONE individual who stated they would continue to care for the children, I think every single one of you ought to lose your license!! Your priorities are f'd up!! How dare you put needy families out on the street and in a corner when they are already in trouble!! If you rely so closely (financially) on a couple of families' childcare bills for your own financial security, you have other issues other than IF you should continue to care for the children!

How old are you people? How long have you been doing this?! Crikey!! The last shutdown in MN was in 2005 and it lasted two weeks. Big whoop!! You can't carry someone for TWO weeks?! And who is the moron that said "give only basic care?" SICK!! These are innocent children who need to be treated the same as private-pay children. EVERY day of the week!! Not just when you are getting paid!! How can you discriminate?

I don't know how I got to this forum but I am disgusted!! I had to use daycare assistance when I was a young mother (and not receiving child support) WHILE I WAS WORKING AND GOING TO SCHOOL TO BETTER MY AND MY CHILDREN'S LIFE!! It's not bad enough these pathetic politicians have the nerve to let this happen to us (I receive CCAP funds for a child I care for AND my ex is a state employee so NO child support until this is over!! Double whammy for me financially!...should I stop caring for my child now because I am not receiving child support?!?!) but now child care providers are putting children out?! As far as I'm concerned, the people who posted here are just like the politicians. Had we made them stay in a room (with no A/C...since there's no $$ for anything) all 4th of July weekend until they came to an agreement, I'm tellin' ya: they'd have agreed an a budget before Saturday afternoon!! How dare those politicians go on holiday weekend last weekend while SO many people are left twisting in the wind!!!!!

Put your real names out here providers!! Let your clients know how you really feel about them and their assistance status. Bet you won't have to worry about getting paid anymore. I know I'd yank my kids out of your care!! You can fill all your "slots" with private pay children.....let those kids get referred to as "slots"!! UGH!! Ya....you all completely disgusted me this a.m.

[heyhun77]

If I was the client of any of you providers who are going off about YOUR income and YOUR life, I would NEVER return my kids to your care!! Is it me or ? Don't most people expect the people who do childcare to be primarily concerned for children? NOT $$$$$!! These families are already (obviously) needing help BEFORE shutdown or they wouldn't be receiving childcare assistance! And now they will likely have to choose between a job or no job because you providers won't care for their children for the interim? UNBELIEVABLE!!

To the person who said her clients have already received more help than (s)he ever has: SHAME ON YOU!! You are obviously biased and prejudiced and resentful!! I don't believe for one second you don't "look" at those children differently than the other "private-pay" children. And if YOU are being paid....if YOUR name is on that payment for childcare....then I put it to you that YOU are also a beneficiary of the assistance!! If you want to be so high and mighty, refuse to care for children who are recipients of childcare assistance!

With the exception of the ONE individual who stated they would continue to care for the children, I think every single one of you ought to lose your license!! Your priorities are f'd up!! How dare you put needy families out on the street and in a corner when they are already in trouble!! If you rely so closely (financially) on a couple of families' childcare bills for your own financial security, you have other issues other than IF you should continue to care for the children!

How old are you people? How long have you been doing this?! Crikey!! The last shutdown in MN was in 2005 and it lasted two weeks. Big whoop!! You can't carry someone for TWO weeks?! And who is the moron that said "give only basic care?" SICK!! These are innocent children who need to be treated the same as private-pay children. EVERY day of the week!! Not just when you are getting paid!! How can you discriminate?

I don't know how I got to this forum but I am disgusted!! I had to use daycare assistance when I was a young mother (and not receiving child support) WHILE I WAS WORKING AND GOING TO SCHOOL TO BETTER MY AND MY CHILDREN'S LIFE!! It's not bad enough these pathetic politicians have the nerve to let this happen to us (I receive CCAP funds for a child I care for AND my ex is a state employee so NO child support until this is over!! Double whammy for me financially!...should I stop caring for my child now because I am not receiving child support?!?!) but now child care providers are putting children out?! As far as I'm concerned, the people who posted here are just like the politicians. Had we made them stay in a room (with no A/C...since there's no $$ for anything) all 4th of July weekend until they came to an agreement, I'm tellin' ya: they'd have agreed an a budget before Saturday afternoon!! How dare those politicians go on holiday weekend last weekend while SO many people are left twisting in the wind!!!!!

Put your real names out here providers!! Let your clients know how you really feel about them and their assistance status. Bet you won't have to worry about getting paid anymore. I know I'd yank my kids out of your care!! You can fill all your "slots" with private pay children.....let those kids get referred to as "slots"!! UGH!! Ya....you all completely disgusted me this a.m.

I'm not sure that it's truely JUST about the money so much as it is the prospect of working for free because there is no real guarantee of payment while everyone is in limbo.

Is it easy to be the one put in this position? Absolutely not. If it was me on that side of the river having to make this decision I would likely come to a compromise like most have mentioned and come up with some creative payment options with the client before just letting them go. That being said, my mortgage lender isn't going to accept a creative payment arrangement when the mortgage is due on the house I use to provide these childcare services. The power company may make some arrangements but they, too, want their money in order to keep the lights and heat/air going for another month. The grocery store isn't going to extend me a line of credit for the food to feed the children in my care just because I'm wanting to continue care for families caught in the middle of this mess.

Childcare providers are usually in this job because of a love for children and teaching and not for the money because any way you cut it, this is not a well-paying profession. This is a hugely politcal situation and it truely comes down for most providers to it being a business decision of how much care can they afford to give for free. If it was me, and my personal business, presently I could afford maybe one child to continue coming without knowing when payment would be made but if I was in the situation like so many out there where 75-90 or even 100% of their clients are childcare assistance clients you just can't run a business on love. Period. As much as I love children, I would have to make the tough decision to let them go until this ordeal is over.

I'm stepping off my soapbox now and hope that this made sense. I just want you to see that it's not necessarily an argument of love of money vs. love of children. If childcare is your profession, your business, you have to make a smart decision for the health of the business or your business will fail.

[nannyde]

If I was the client of any of you providers who are going off about YOUR income and YOUR life, I would NEVER return my kids to your care!! Is it me or ? Don't most people expect the people who do childcare to be primarily concerned for children? NOT $$$$$!! These families are already (obviously) needing help BEFORE shutdown or they wouldn't be receiving childcare assistance! And now they will likely have to choose between a job or no job because you providers won't care for their children for the interim? UNBELIEVABLE!!

To the person who said her clients have already received more help than (s)he ever has: SHAME ON YOU!! You are obviously biased and prejudiced and resentful!! I don't believe for one second you don't "look" at those children differently than the other "private-pay" children. And if YOU are being paid....if YOUR name is on that payment for childcare....then I put it to you that YOU are also a beneficiary of the assistance!! If you want to be so high and mighty, refuse to care for children who are recipients of childcare assistance!

With the exception of the ONE individual who stated they would continue to care for the children, I think every single one of you ought to lose your license!! Your priorities are f'd up!! How dare you put needy families out on the street and in a corner when they are already in trouble!! If you rely so closely (financially) on a couple of families' childcare bills for your own financial security, you have other issues other than IF you should continue to care for the children!

How old are you people? How long have you been doing this?! Crikey!! The last shutdown in MN was in 2005 and it lasted two weeks. Big whoop!! You can't carry someone for TWO weeks?! And who is the moron that said "give only basic care?" SICK!! These are innocent children who need to be treated the same as private-pay children. EVERY day of the week!! Not just when you are getting paid!! How can you discriminate?

I don't know how I got to this forum but I am disgusted!! I had to use daycare assistance when I was a young mother (and not receiving child support) WHILE I WAS WORKING AND GOING TO SCHOOL TO BETTER MY AND MY CHILDREN'S LIFE!! It's not bad enough these pathetic politicians have the nerve to let this happen to us (I receive CCAP funds for a child I care for AND my ex is a state employee so NO child support until this is over!! Double whammy for me financially!...should I stop caring for my child now because I am not receiving child support?!?!) but now child care providers are putting children out?! As far as I'm concerned, the people who posted here are just like the politicians. Had we made them stay in a room (with no A/C...since there's no $$ for anything) all 4th of July weekend until they came to an agreement, I'm tellin' ya: they'd have agreed an a budget before Saturday afternoon!! How dare those politicians go on holiday weekend last weekend while SO many people are left twisting in the wind!!!!!

Put your real names out here providers!! Let your clients know how you really feel about them and their assistance status. Bet you won't have to worry about getting paid anymore. I know I'd yank my kids out of your care!! You can fill all your "slots" with private pay children.....let those kids get referred to as "slots"!! UGH!! Ya....you all completely disgusted me this a.m.

If I was the client of any of you providers who are going off about YOUR income and YOUR life, I would NEVER return my kids to your care!! Is it me or ? Don't most people expect the people who do childcare to be primarily concerned for children? NOT $$$$$!!

No it's not you unfortunately. Many people expect the people who do childcare to be primarily concerned about the children ... not money. The problem is finding providers who think the same way since they have to have money as their primary concern to care for their own children and family.

These families are already (obviously) needing help BEFORE shutdown or they wouldn't be receiving childcare assistance! And now they will likely have to choose between a job or no job because you providers won't care for their children for the interim? UNBELIEVABLE!!

It's the parents respeonsibility to make sure they have a place to take their chld while they work. The parents have accessed a funding that may not be available all the time. They need to manage THAT part of the funding they accessed. It's not just about getting free day care. There are human beings behind the decision of whether or not the taxpayers CAN pay for the free day care. It's a risk they take when they sign on to it. It's good when it's good but not good when it's not so good.

You are somehow making it have to do with the provider and it doesn't have a thing to do with her. She must have guaranteed payment for her services. This is between the parent and the State. Keep the provider out of it. She has a service to offer that costs money. When the client presents without ability to make sure the services are paid for then she isn't able to provide the service.

To the person who said her clients have already received more help than (s)he ever has: SHAME ON YOU!! You are obviously biased and prejudiced and resentful!! I don't believe for one second you don't "look" at those children differently than the other "private-pay" children.

That would be Cathearder.

To Cathearder: When you go back to work on Monday take a good long look at the State paid kids and tell me you don't look at them differently than the private pay kids.

To Laura: Cat just has private pay kids but I'm sure she'll take a look at the state paid kids she doesn't have. She's crazy like that.

And if YOU are being paid....if YOUR name is on that payment for childcare....then I put it to you that YOU are also a beneficiary of the assistance!! If you want to be so high and mighty, refuse to care for children who are recipients of childcare assistance!

So when a person goes to a store and buys food and pays for it in food stamps then the STORE is the beneficiary of that??????????

How dat work? :confused: The beneficiary isn't the person who has a cart full of groceries to put in their cabinet... it's the STORE????????

How old are you people? How long have you been doing this?!

50 and this is my 32nd year of caring for kids. almost 18 in home child care.

Put your real names out here providers!! Let your clients know how you really feel about them and their assistance status. Bet you won't have to worry about getting paid anymore.

Tori Fees I'm from Des Moines Iowa. I own A Nurse's Home Day Care. I don't have state paid clients but if I did I would tell them what you said to tell them. I don't want to work for a state paid client that doesn't GET that it's about the money. As little as our State pays for state paid day care... every single cent of the paltry payment would definitely HAVE to be about THE MONEY. The pay is REDICULOUSLY low.

I know I'd yank my kids out of your care!! You wouldn't have gotten past the first phone call much less given an actual interview. I can smell "it's not about the money" when it's someone ELSE'S money a mile away.


You can fill all your "slots" with private pay children.....let those kids get referred to as "slots"!!

Already do that and yes I refer to their space in my day care as "slots".

If you are so gung ho about people providing child care for love and not money then why don't you open a free day care and start providing it? If you offer free your slots would fill up in a few days. Go for it.