State Pay Families?

[Blackcat31]

I am located in MN and was told that I had to be willing to accept state pay. Now, I am sure you could easily come up with a reason they aren't a 'good fit' for your facility, but we are not allowed to say no due to accepting state pay...at least that is what my licensor told me.

Are you sure?

I haven't heard of a State requiring a provider to take State paid.

I don't have State paid clients because the rate is really low. I would loose hundreds of dollars per month on each slot.

In MN you are NOT required to accept Child Care Assistant Program (CCAP)participants. That is an individual choice. There are several child care centers and family child care homes in my area that simply do not accept families on assistance due to the hassles involved.

As a provider who does take CCAP families, I do it because I do not mind the small amount of additional paperwork required and I like the guarantee of payment. Our state has a good system in place that ensures the provider the payment that is due and that the parent is the one who they go after when their responsibilties are not met.

[nannyde]

In MN you are NOT required to accept Child Care Assistant Program (CCAP)participants. That is an individual choice. There are several child care centers and family child care homes in my area that simply do not accept families on assistance due to the hassles involved.

As a provider who does take CCAP families, I do it because I do not mind the small amount of additional paperwork required and I like the guarantee of payment. Our state has a good system in place that ensures the provider the payment that is due and that the parent is the one who they go after when their responsibilties are not met.

I would take it if the pay wasn't so low. In my State they pay per five hour unit. About $11.50 per unit. If the kid is there five hours and fifteen minutes then it would be decent money. ($23 for 5.25 hours = $4.38 per hour) Once you get into the second unit each day they can have as many as ten hours. That comes to $2.20 per hour.

If I interviewed with a family that needed a little over five hours I would consider it but I've learned in the past that "a little over five hours" turns into ten hours after a few weeks or months.

My biggest beef with the child care funding in my State is that it isn't required for the recipient to PROVE that they have attempted to access child support BEFORE they attempt to access child care funding. They should be required to go to Daddy before they go to Uncle Sam. That loophole ushers a lot of scamming into the system.

[Blackcat31]

I would take it if the pay wasn't so low. In my State they pay per five hour unit. About $11.50 per unit. If the kid is there five hours and fifteen minutes then it would be decent money. ($23 for 5.25 hours = $4.38 per hour) Once you get into the second unit each day they can have as many as ten hours. That comes to $2.20 per hour.

If I interviewed with a family that needed a little over five hours I would consider it but I've learned in the past that "a little over five hours" turns into ten hours after a few weeks or months.

My biggest beef with the child care funding in my State is that it isn't required for the recipient to PROVE that they have attempted to access child support BEFORE they attempt to access child care funding. They should be required to go to Daddy before they go to Uncle Sam. That loophole ushers a lot of scamming into the system.

Yeah, that would change my mind too! Here, the state pays by the hour or by the day or the week. However the provider chooses to bill. Families are not allowed to get assistance unless they work a minimum of 20 hours per week. (and yes, our state mandates anyone who gets assistance to also seek child support and if the family does not, the county does) I have one mom who didn't want to give up the info on her babydaddy so the state denied her assistance. Why should the tax payers foot her child care bill?

I bill by the week which the state defines as 32 hours per week. Anything the state does not cover, I am aware of ahead of time and the family has to pay the difference on a pre-pay basis. I also get a higher reimbursement rate because I have a CDA/(soon to be bachleor's degree). The state pays 15% more for providers who have a degree, OR a CDA OR are accreditied.

[jen2651]

Interesting....I was told by my licensor that we were required to accept assistance. This would def. be worth something to look into! It hasn't been a problem yet though...where I am located (as sad as this is) you are either making minimum wage or much more...seems the only people looking for decent daycare are those making much more. My guess is the lower income bracket has lots of friends/family watching their children.

[Blackcat31]

Interesting....I was told by my licensor that we were required to accept assistance. This would def. be worth something to look into! It hasn't been a problem yet though...where I am located (as sad as this is) you are either making minimum wage or much more...seems the only people looking for decent daycare are those making much more. My guess is the lower income bracket has lots of friends/family watching their children.

If you need help or have any questions about the way the assistance program works in MN just PM me and I will be glad to help....I've got a ton of experience with it and I also have talked directly with the supervising people at MN DHS so let me know if you need anything. I will gladly help.

[treehugger82]

Update...

So I have phone interviewed 2 moms who want me to take DHS (state) pmt. The one is REALLY persistent that she LOVES my program and wants her kids here. Ok, fine...I ask why she is leaving the very popular, hard to get your kids into daycare they are in now....she says they are too expensive. I say well, if you don't mind me asking, what are they charging you? She says they are charging her X amount....same as my price. She never asked my price, I didn't offer. She wants me to take only what the state if offering (which is peanuts, really) and not extend a co-pay to her. I tell her I don't think that will cover my costs. She still doesn't ask my price and says, "I can't find anywhere cheaper to take them and I can't afford my $100/wk co-pay (sniffle)". OH MAN....she is a single mom, 2 kids, living in subsidized housing with a decent job, but I tell ya, I worked out every which way I could trying to figure out how to help her without sticking it to my pocketbook and taking up 2 spaces that could be generating decent income for me, but I can not figure out a way to make what I need to without charging her a co-pay. <SIGH> I feel bad for her, but I know if I try to work with her and take less $$ I am going to be resentful eventually. The state only pays $140/wk for two kids!!!!

[cheerfuldom]

Don't change your policy to accommodate. You will regret getting stuck with two spots filled and not enough income. Shes just going to have to work out a way to pay for daycare like the rest of America.

[Meeko]

State pay limits

State pay per child - Utah
Providers can charge as much as they like and parent must pay any difference. We are not required to take state pay.

0-24 mths $450 mth
2&3 yr olds $430 mth
4&5 yr olds $420 mth
school age (out of school) $389 mth
school age (in school) $272 mth

This is as of 2009. I understand they are going to be raising it some time this year.

My day care parents don't have to pay very large co-pays. In fact 3 of them pay nothing at all out of their own pocket.

[nannyde]

So I have phone interviewed 2 moms who want me to take DHS (state) pmt. The one is REALLY persistent that she LOVES my program and wants her kids here. Ok, fine...I ask why she is leaving the very popular, hard to get your kids into daycare they are in now....she says they are too expensive. I say well, if you don't mind me asking, what are they charging you? She says they are charging her X amount....same as my price. She never asked my price, I didn't offer. She wants me to take only what the state if offering (which is peanuts, really) and not extend a co-pay to her. I tell her I don't think that will cover my costs. She still doesn't ask my price and says, "I can't find anywhere cheaper to take them and I can't afford my $100/wk co-pay (sniffle)". OH MAN....she is a single mom, 2 kids, living in subsidized housing with a decent job, but I tell ya, I worked out every which way I could trying to figure out how to help her without sticking it to my pocketbook and taking up 2 spaces that could be generating decent income for me, but I can not figure out a way to make what I need to without charging her a co-pay. <SIGH> I feel bad for her, but I know if I try to work with her and take less $$ I am going to be resentful eventually. The state only pays $140/wk for two kids!!!!

at she is asking you to do would be illegal in my State. If 70 dollars a week would be acceptable to a provider then SHE should pay her 50 dollars per week co-pay per kid then the State would pick up the other 20... NOT the other way around where the State pays the full 70.

About ten years ago I worked on the evening shift for a Mom that had three and then four kids. The kids were little dolls. It was awesome money because the kids came in at four p.m. and were in bed by seven. Three hours of awake time and an out the door at midnight. The getting up to let them out the door at midnight was the only part that ****ed.

She had nearly free housing (70 dollars per month heat included)... three bedroom duplex that was really big, a six hundred dollar per year energy credit for the electric, WIC for all the kids, food stamps, and child care for FOUR kids (nearly $500 a week)

Her co-pay was 400 dollars per YEAR. She was the wealthiest dc parent I have ever worked for. She had everything paid! She made ten bucks an hour and got THOUSANDS of dollars per year in Earned Income Credit. She got to keep her entire check and got a big refund every year.

I worked for her for nearly three years and she was wonderful to work for. Never had a moments problem. She always could afford everything the kids needed. It didn't end well though because I got a preliminary audit from the State of Iowa regarding my income because there was a 20 THOUSAND dollar difference between what I claimed and what was claimed against me. I found out that she had been claiming the money the STATE paid me on her three and then four kids each year instead of just claiming her measly 400 a year she actually paid. She was claiming 15 THOUSAND dollars of money that she didn't pay. I only claimed what the State paid and her co-pay so I was getting dinged twice for the 15K.

Luckily for me, I was on the phone with the State tax people and she came to drop off her kids. When we realized what the error was I said "hold on" she's here. I'll have you talk to her... and handed her the phone.

She tells them it's a Turbo Tax error.

She left my daycare right after that. The State wanted their money back so she just left town. So I got hit with a huge income loss but the State stopped the audit process.

Also found out a client with two kids I hadn't even SEEN the year before was claiming 5000 child care on his two kids for that year. The kids hadn't even been in my house once that year. That was a "turbo tax" error too.

[momma2girls]

I used to take state paid families about 5 yrs. ago, and would never do it again!! I was paid only $14.00 per day per child. I normally charged at that time $25.00 per day, per child. SO that one family of 2 children, I was loosing $22.00 per day, so take that times 5 days per week, over $100.00 per week on one family!!!! It totally wasn't worth it. Then another note, I wouldn't receive any days off, Holidays, Vac. sick, etc.... then I wasn't paid for about 3 weeks, after I sent in the paperwork, which was already a month behind, you did it at the end of the month!! It totally was not worth it at all!!!

[morgan24]

So I have phone interviewed 2 moms who want me to take DHS (state) pmt. The one is REALLY persistent that she LOVES my program and wants her kids here. Ok, fine...I ask why she is leaving the very popular, hard to get your kids into daycare they are in now....she says they are too expensive. I say well, if you don't mind me asking, what are they charging you? She says they are charging her X amount....same as my price. She never asked my price, I didn't offer. She wants me to take only what the state if offering (which is peanuts, really) and not extend a co-pay to her. I tell her I don't think that will cover my costs. She still doesn't ask my price and says, "I can't find anywhere cheaper to take them and I can't afford my $100/wk co-pay (sniffle)". OH MAN....she is a single mom, 2 kids, living in subsidized housing with a decent job, but I tell ya, I worked out every which way I could trying to figure out how to help her without sticking it to my pocketbook and taking up 2 spaces that could be generating decent income for me, but I can not figure out a way to make what I need to without charging her a co-pay. <SIGH> I feel bad for her, but I know if I try to work with her and take less $$ I am going to be resentful eventually. The state only pays $140/wk for two kids!!!!

Don't let her talk you into just accepting what the state will pay. Her circumstances are not your problem. She should be grateful for what the state is helping her with and not gripe about her co-pay. You will find a lot of people who get the state assistance will want you to just accept that as your total pay. If you figure out how much you will lose over time, it's a lot of money. Don't back down on her paying her co-pay.

[Unregistered]

The state pay is quite simple here in PA. They actually pay more than I charge (I get my rate). The only complaint I have is....when our state budget didn't get passed for so many months I didn't get payed. I had 4 kids on state pay with no money coming in. Can you beleive that? I probably make the least but they take my money first. I got a lump check in the end of course but it was a struggle.

[treehugger82]

Don't change your policy to accommodate. You will regret getting stuck with two spots filled and not enough income. Shes just going to have to work out a way to pay for daycare like the rest of America.

That's kind of what I thought too. At least she gets some assistance! I would be greatful for that.

at she is asking you to do would be illegal in my State. If 70 dollars a week would be acceptable to a provider then SHE should pay her 50 dollars per week co-pay per kid then the State would pick up the other 20... NOT the other way around where the State pays the full 70.

About ten years ago I worked on the evening shift for a Mom that had three and then four kids. The kids were little dolls. It was awesome money because the kids came in at four p.m. and were in bed by seven. Three hours of awake time and an out the door at midnight. The getting up to let them out the door at midnight was the only part that ****ed.

She had nearly free housing (70 dollars per month heat included)... three bedroom duplex that was really big, a six hundred dollar per year energy credit for the electric, WIC for all the kids, food stamps, and child care for FOUR kids (nearly $500 a week)

Her co-pay was 400 dollars per YEAR. .

I don't think it's the same in Mich, where they pay and then the state pays, but I could be wrong. She did want me to bill for hours they are not here, up to her max allowable, so her co-pay was less, but I told her on the phone that I couldn't do that b/c I didn't want to be investigated and have my paperwork not match up.

$400/year? That's insane. How do people work the system like that? Sheesh!

Don't let her talk you into just accepting what the state will pay. Her circumstances are not your problem. She should be grateful for what the state is helping her with and not gripe about her co-pay. You will find a lot of people who get the state assistance will want you to just accept that as your total pay. If you figure out how much you will lose over time, it's a lot of money. Don't back down on her paying her co-pay.

Pretty much where I'm at. I know I will look at that amount I could be getting and be so mad eventually. Plus, my dh is an accounting major, his father is an accountant....they will light my butt on fire if they see me shorting myself to benefit someone else financially .

She has been pushing for an interview, no matter how many times or ways I say that I cannot take less for the kids' care. Maybe she thinks if I meet her and her kids, it will be easier to convince me? I think I will email her and tell her that it's not going to work out.

[MarinaVanessa]

She has been pushing for an interview, no matter how many times or ways I say that I cannot take less for the kids' care. Maybe she thinks if I meet her and her kids, it will be easier to convince me? I think I will email her and tell her that it's not going to work out.

I agree with you YOU SHOULD NOT make an exception for her. It already seems like a bad deal she has already told you that she couldn't make her co-payments to the other place and she's asking you to lower your rates for her (that's pretty much what it comes down to) all BEFORE you've even interviewed her in person. I think the best thing to do is walk away. The only person that loses anything here is you and remember, in the end you're in this to make money. Good luck.

[Childminder]

Originally Posted by treehugger82 View Post
She has been pushing for an interview, no matter how many times or ways I say that I cannot take less for the kids' care. Maybe she thinks if I meet her and her kids, it will be easier to convince me? I think I will email her and tell her that it's not going to work out.
I agree with you YOU SHOULD NOT make an exception for her. It already seems like a bad deal she has already told you that she couldn't make her co-payments to the other place and she's asking you to lower your rates for her (that's pretty much what it comes down to) all BEFORE you've even interviewed her in person. I think the best thing to do is walk away. The only person that loses anything here is you and remember, in the end you're in this to make money. Good luck.
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Why would you even consider making an exception for her? Is she your best friend in the whole world? your own child? the most wonderful golden parent that will ever exist? Trust me she will take all she can get from you and walk away in the end with a knife in your back. Does she walk into the local grocery store and ask for a discount? You are a business not a charity.