Unbelieveable, Why Nosy People and Gov't Need to Stay Out of Our Business

[Chickenhauler]

That's not the issue here. It's an HOUR. She's not in it for a career, she's watching some kids while they wait for a bus. What's the point of going through the hassles for AN HOUR? It's ridiculous.

In this lady's case, I do believe that the fact that there is no compensation changing hands should be the determining factor.

And so it seems that the legislator agrees:

State Rep. Brian Calley, R-Portland, said he was working to draft legislation that would exempt situations like Snyder's from coverage under Michigan's current day care regulations.

The bill will make it clear that people who aren't in business as day care providers don't need to be licensed, Calley said.

I'm sure there is more to this story than is being reported, I bet this lady and whoever reported her have a long standing cat fight, and this was just one of the battles in the war.

[mac60]

I have to ask....would you skimp on putting a fireproof door in place between the garage and the home if it were your call? Or would you just put up a hollow core interior door to save a few bucks?

I sure wouldn't......and I bet it was code for any new construction.

When my mother got licensed, she had to change her upstairs windows to egress style, and add an anchored rope ladder to one bedroom floor that could be unfurled out the window in an emergency. Think what would have happened should a fire break out WITH the old windows (which the cat could barely get through, much less a person).

But, hey, let's do away with all licensing regulations, why bother licensing and inspecting drivers, hazardous waste facilities, eating establishments, building codes, etc. Everyone will use common sense, right?

Without building codes, how many sub-standard roofs, walls, foundations, etc do you think would be built? I can see it now, 2x2 walls on 3 story buildings, floor trusses 36" on center, 1/4 sheating for flooring, etc etc.

With no licensing regs, how many sub-par daycare facilities do you think would be operating? You want to cry about how little you're getting paid now, wait til some mega corp opens a center that hires illegal immigrants for $2 per day to watch 25 kids each.....try competing with that.

The regs are in place for a reason, usually because someone didn't use "common sense".

Usually when you set the bar a little higher, you weed out those who are going to be half-assed. If someone gives up easily when faced with a few challenges, do you really want them caring for kids?

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Chickenhauler.....I normally respect and agree with most of your post, but you went over the top here. Nobody was talking about using a hollow core door for an entry door, nobody was talking about the various building violation codes you described. I mentioned an existing entry door (not a hollow core door but an entry door) having to be replaced with one that had a much longer fire rating in her kitchen/garage, that is all. This poor lady has had nothing but one obstacle after another......for instance, she was told to have a fire inspection, but, everyplace and every surrounding county she calls, or numbers she is given to call to schedule it, there is always something----wrong county--don't do it anymore---etc, there are so many flaws in the licensing systems. How ironic a licensing office would tell you that you need a fire inspection yet can not give you a concrete person/place that you can call and schedule and have it done. She is still working on getting licensed, and it has been over a year, because of the obstacles of the licensing agency. Maybe it is not this way where you live, but it sure is in some states.

If someone gives up easily when faced with a few challenges, do you really want them caring for kids?[/QUOTE]

.............................It is not just a matter of a few challenges, it is a matter of a person trying to make a living, being able to afford to doing it legally, following the rules, all I am saying is that many of the state regs are totally rediculous. I am talking about home daycares, where a family lives in the home and a person cares for a small group of children. I guess I see it that......if my home is good enough for me to live in and raise my own children, then it is good enough to care a few hours for someone elses child. Of coarse we follow common safety things, meds up, outlets covered, safe play area, fenced yard, healthy meals, appropriate activities, clean environment, I could go on and on. I personally don't need the state to tell me how/what to do, I have several parents that are in and out of my home everyday that see what environment their child is in.

[ConcernedMotherof2]

well

How does licensing strip you of that choice?

In the case of the state stepping in and requiring that someone have a license to care for children on a regular basis at all, I would feel as though licensing was stripping me of the choice. It was just a response to the originally posted article. All of the parents of the children the woman was watching now have to make other arrangements, even though the arrangement they had was working for them. Not only was this woman being told she couldn't care for the children, the parents were being told that they couldn't allow her to care for their children.

[Chickenhauler]

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Chickenhauler.....I normally respect and agree with most of your post, but you went over the top here. Nobody was talking about using a hollow core door for an entry door, nobody was talking about the various building violation codes you described. I mentioned an existing entry door (not a hollow core door but an entry door) having to be replaced with one that had a much longer fire rating in her kitchen/garage, that is all. This poor lady has had nothing but one obstacle after another......for instance, she was told to have a fire inspection, but, everyplace and every surrounding county she calls, or numbers she is given to call to schedule it, there is always something----wrong county--don't do it anymore---etc, there are so many flaws in the licensing systems. How ironic a licensing office would tell you that you need a fire inspection yet can not give you a concrete person/place that you can call and schedule and have it done. She is still working on getting licensed, and it has been over a year, because of the obstacles of the licensing agency. Maybe it is not this way where you live, but it sure is in some states.

My point was, these regulations are in place for a reason-without a set standard, people will seek the lowest common denominator in almost every case.

.............................It is not just a matter of a few challenges, it is a matter of a person trying to make a living, being able to afford to doing it legally, following the rules, all I am saying is that many of the state regs are totally rediculous. I am talking about home daycares, where a family lives in the home and a person cares for a small group of children. I guess I see it that......if my home is good enough for me to live in and raise my own children, then it is good enough to care a few hours for someone elses child. Of coarse we follow common safety things, meds up, outlets covered, safe play area, fenced yard, healthy meals, appropriate activities, clean environment, I could go on and on. I personally don't need the state to tell me how/what to do, I have several parents that are in and out of my home everyday that see what environment their child is in.

You may follow a sensible standard, but how many do you think would do these things if there wasn't any regulations regarding this?

If you think it's a hassle trying to meet the standards of doing daycare, interstate trucking would make you pull your hair out by the roots.....each state has their own "special" laws and regs.

Have you ever had a parent take the temp reading of your hot water tap, or your fridge and freezer? Have they ever randomly inspected your bathroom, outlets, stairways, or inspected for egress windows? Has a parent ever asked to check your fire extinguisher's charge, or the date of it's last certification? Have your DC parents asked to examine your CPR cert, or emergency evac plan?

I've never heard of any parent even thinking of looking at this stuff.

[jen]

My point was, these regulations are in place for a reason-without a set standard, people will seek the lowest common denominator in almost every case.



You may follow a sensible standard, but how many do you think would do these things if there wasn't any regulations regarding this?

If you think it's a hassle trying to meet the standards of doing daycare, interstate trucking would make you pull your hair out by the roots.....each state has their own "special" laws and regs.

Have you ever had a parent take the temp reading of your hot water tap, or your fridge and freezer? Have they ever randomly inspected your bathroom, outlets, stairways, or inspected for egress windows? Has a parent ever asked to check your fire extinguisher's charge, or the date of it's last certification? Have your DC parents asked to examine your CPR cert, or emergency evac plan?

I've never heard of any parent even thinking of looking at this stuff.

I hear what you are saying, but I think that the point you are missing is this. I personally don't feel like I need the government to ensure that my kids are safe. If my next door neighbor is watching one family and offers to watch mine as well, I don't need or want the government telling me no. If I am comfortable that her house is safe, that should be good enough. Now, if the government is paying for my daycare, they can certainly have their say. But, as long as I am paying for it (or not paying for in this case) it isn't their concern. The underlying issue here is that the government doesn't think that we as parents are capable of choosing a provider.

[Unregistered]

Devil's Advocate

Not in anyway saying this is the unlicensed providers on this forum. You ladies all seem to have it going on and have an enormous amount of love and attention for the children and families you care for.
What about the parents, that have been discussed in another thread, obviously don't give a rat's patootie about the well being of their children. They would probably be fine dropping the children off with whomever will keep them and not get them busted for leaving the 3 year old home alone with a box of crackers. Are they paying attention to how many kids the lady is "taking care of", or do they even care?
We can't throw the baby out with the bath water. DCFS has it's place. There are people out there who will take in as many children as possible doing whatever with them, just keeping them alive until the parents show. And there are parents who will take them to these places. The same parents that don't dress their children for the weather, don't change their diapers, don't bathe them, don't feed them appropriately, give them benadryl to put them to sleep.....
YOU would never do this, but OTHERS would. There needs to be someone out there making sure these types of operations aren't going down. I hardly ever agree with chickenhauler, but I agree that if they took away the regulations there would be legal warehousing of children with little to no quality control. Pack them in folks, it's cheap and efficient.
I don't think you should have to be licensed if you don't want to be, it should be up to the individual. But sometimes that really depends on the rationale and intentions of the individual.
I know it's not a perfect system, nothing is. But the system is their to protect children. Even if it is to protect them from their own parents and the decisions their parents make.