Is This Legal?

[Ariana]

A woman in my area just started taking kids for "craft days and evenings". Her whole shtick is that it gives parents time for running errands etc and even date nights in the evenings. She will have a craft day from 1-4pm and charge $25 per kid and then date night will be fom 7-9pm at $25 per kid. She welcomes children of all ages.

Does this sound legal to you? I am in Canada so we are allowed to be legally unlicensed with up to 5 kids including our own. She has a teenage assistant with her but it looks like she takes in a lot of kids at a time, up to 10.

This is someone who has run a bunch of businesses out of her home trying to make money. Nothing wrong with that but this just doesn't seem legit to me especially since I can't do it legally!

[mommyneedsadayoff]

Im not sure if it is legal, but it does touch on the topic of babysitting that has been plauging me lately. With operations like this, 24/7 care, and late night care, do babysitters even exist anymore? It all seems to fall under the daycare radar (meaning less per hr).

[Mike]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm 99% sure from the research I did that it's not legal if she is watching more than 5 kids total. From what I remember (was a few years ago I did the study), as long as you are being paid to watch other people's kids, you have to abide by the limits. The Ontario unlicensed limit is 5 no matter how many adults there are.

I'm betting she didn't even look into the rules and regulations. Just start a new business and hope for the best.

[childcaremom]

How old are the kids? Is it a babysitting service or a craft night?

I have no idea on the regulations but there are a few people who do 'paint nite' type things for kids out of their homes. It is a popular birthday party thing here. I would think there would be some regulations on it but not sure that it would fall under home daycare regulations.

[Play Care]

In my State the hours and numbers would matter. Less than 3 hours is not regulated, which is why a lot of preschools keep their hours to under 3 and do morning and afternoon classes.

IMO (and I think the "legal" definition) of babysitting, is when you are providing care for kids in THEIR home. I think once you do it at your home, or a different location, it becomes tricky.

[Puddleduck]

How often is she offering the service? I think it has to be consistent in order to be called daycare...but with the new unclear regulations I'm not entirely sure.
I do know that having an assistant means nothing if it does qualify as daycare. It would still be 5 kids maximum no matter how many adults are present.

[Puddleduck]

The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced it would qualify as home child care and she would have to follow the Child Care and Early Years Act.
If she was providing the service to people for say, a birthday party in someone else's home, I think she could work around that. But if it's in her home and she's accepting money...that's child care according to our gov't.

[Ariana]

Yes it is a VERY grey area! I think if the children are over the age of 6 you can have more kids but under that they need to follow the Early Years Act of Ontario.

I contacted her directly and she knew the rules and regulations and assured me she only has 6 kids and not more than 2 under the age of 5. That was a relief because I would love to send my kid! I also am thinking it might be a great business opportunity for me as well

She is running a March break camp and right on the ad she says that there is only 5 spaces and they are age dependent. I think she knows her stuff which is GREAT!

[Mike]

It sounds like she may know what she's doing, which is a good thing.

The magic age here is 10. Limits are:

Ontario licensed:
- 6 children under age 10
- 2 children under age 2
- your own children under age 6 are included

If you operate with 2 child care providers, you may be allowed to double the numbers.

Ontario unlicensed:
- 5 children under age 10
- 2 children under age 2
- your own children under age 6 are included

more details - Child Care and Early Years Act

https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/14c11?_ga=1.49093606.1152304998.1454301672

I posted the limits for all Canadian provinces over at another forum that's pretty much dead.

http://www.godaycare.com/daycareforum/index.php?topic=2872.0

[Ariana]

It sounds like she may know what she's doing, which is a good thing.

The magic age here is 10. Limits are:

Ontario licensed:
- 6 children under age 10
- 2 children under age 2
- your own children under age 6 are included

If you operate with 2 child care providers, you may be allowed to double the numbers.

Ontario unlicensed:
- 5 children under age 10
- 2 children under age 2
- your own children under age 6 are included

more details - Child Care and Early Years Act

https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/14c11?_ga=1.49093606.1152304998.1454301672

I posted the limits for all Canadian provinces over at another forum that's pretty much dead.
http://www.godaycare.com/daycareforu...p?topic=2872.0

Thanks Mike!

[Jupadia]

It sounds like she may know what she's doing, which is a good thing.

The magic age here is 10. Limits are:

Ontario licensed:
- 6 children under age 10
- 2 children under age 2
- your own children under age 6 are included

If you operate with 2 child care providers, you may be allowed to double the numbers.

Ontario unlicensed:
- 5 children under age 10
- 2 children under age 2
- your own children under age 6 are included

more details - Child Care and Early Years Act

https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/14c11?_ga=1.49093606.1152304998.1454301672

I posted the limits for all Canadian provinces over at another forum that's pretty much dead.
http://www.godaycare.com/daycareforu...p?topic=2872.0

Sorry to correct but under the new early learning act for Ontario children up age 13 count in numbers. Also it no longer mater how many providers are on site you can only have the limits you listed.

OP
Care in school / business hours requires same supervision as evenings or other times of day. The only exception would be for kids over 4 and if it's a camp. (Don't know eat camp regulations would be).

[Mike]

Sorry to correct but under the new early learning act for Ontario children up age 13 count in numbers. Also it no longer mater how many providers are on site you can only have the limits you listed.

Correct away.
As I posted on the other site, things do change.

[Jupadia]

Correct away.
As I posted on the other site, things do change.

Thanks for not minding I just know cause the new regulations realy effected how many kids I could have cause my boys both have to be counted now where before they never.

I also know of one exception for providers allowed 5 kids. This can incress to 6 if you (provider) has a child age 4 or 5 enrolled in school. Then you can have 6 kids with only 1 under 2.

[LovetheSun]

In my State the hours and numbers would matter. Less than 3 hours is not regulated, which is why a lot of preschools keep their hours to under 3 and do morning and afternoon classes.

IMO (and I think the "legal" definition) of babysitting, is when you are providing care for kids in THEIR home. I think once you do it at your home, or a different location, it becomes tricky.

Anyone knows if this applies to California as well?

There are a few preschools in our area who only offer 3 hours care, maybe thats why?