The New Family....

[Denali]

New family started. Not sure if they will work out...

They first wanted to drop off at 12:30, which we are usually already laying down for nap at this point. Explained this and we would try it, but the 3 kids would need to come fed and ready for nap.

They wound up coming at 12:15.

During drop off (took 15 minutes) i found out the 3 year old doesn't nap. Mom telling me that the reason he was having a hard time was because the other daycare put him in a high chair to "cry it out" because he wouldn't nap there and it traumatized him . And that the other daycare also left 2 younger kids in pack and plays crying and made their 7 year old sibling care of them. I had to keep walking away and leaving her to try and settle and talk with dcb3 because I still had diapers I needed to change and get the other 4 kids down for nap.

The 3 year old boy cried his eyes out when mom finally left, and the 8 month and 19 months old actually did ok. Dcb3 took 10 minutes to settle.

As soon as I put the baby in the pack and play he cried. Was fine as long as I held him actually. Wound up having to put him in his car seat and rocking him until he fell asleep. 19 month old wouldn't say put on her cot, so I put her in the Pack and play. She also started crying. Dcb3 had actually fallen asleep on the couch during this time, so I left him there.

I had to get dcg19months next to me and sing (which I don't mind doing) her to sleep. Anytime I tried to take dc baby out of car seat he'd start crying, which lead me to have to rock him until he was asleep again.

Dcb3 slept all of nap time. The other 2 siblings slept for about an hour.

The rest of the day went good (for a first day) except that the 8 month baby had to be held or have me right next to him and within touching distance. Sometimes he'd be content if he was distracted to by a toy but other than that he'd cry. Anytime I pick him up he would immediately stop crying and paw and scratch me (not on purpose but his nails have never been cut so they are long) and be fine until I had to put him down to tend to other children. He is formula fed.

They also didn't bring any extra clothes and brought just enough diapers for the day. My policy states that each child must have one extra pair of clothes regardless of age.

When enrolling they told us that just after 5pm would be the normal pick up the rare occasion being almost 5:30pm. Dad didn't pull into my driveway until 5:33pm. 3 minutes passed closing.

I sent some questions to the family last night. Here are some of them and there answers:

What is your families nap and bed time routine? Do children get laid down in cribs/bed and they fall sleep on their own? Are they held or rocked or placed in a swing until they fall asleep?

-DCG19months sleeps in the crib. Dcb8months falls asleep either in the swing or on the bed.

What are the typical times that your kids go down for nap and bed time?

-didn't answer this question.

Do you baby-wear, co-sleep, or use a swing or bouncy at home? If so when? And typically for how long?

-I occasionally babywear, but he does co-sleep with me, uses a swing, and plays in a bouncer, and they are all rotated throughout the day when we're not playing.

I noticed today that dcb8months had a hard time being put down or being independent while I changed other children's diapers, that he would cry when I had to leave his side to help another child, or helped another child with potting. This could be just because he is in a new place and with someone different, and he should be fine in a few days of coming, but how is he at home topically in these circumstances?

-I'm sure that's what it is. They aren't around anybody else up here except our household. They've never met our extended family members or anything.


Today drop off was to be 9am (they're contracted time they put down were 8:30ish - 12:30ish and pick up time 5-5:30) but mom dropped off at 8:30am. My didn't bring extra clothes for dcb3. And there was only 1 diaper (the one I have left from yesterday) and it was saturated with water from something spelling in the diaper bag.

I called mom at 8:30 and told her that I needed diapers brought and I'd need extra clothes for dcb3 brought daily (this was the 2 time telling her this other then at interview) dad just dropped off 12 diapers for 2 children in diapers that are supposed to cover me until after 5 today (mom told me that both her and dad get off at 5 today).


How would you address these concerns and problems? Would you even bother continuing given that this is only day 2?

[Denali]

Also eight-month-old baby is not mobile, cannot set up by himself, and it is strictly on formula only as he doesn't like baby food.

It's been two years since I've had an infant, and can't remember if this is a typical or not ...

And I feel dumb for asking but...

[Leigh]

New family started. Not sure if they will work out...

They first wanted to drop off at 12:30, which we are usually already laying down for nap at this point. Explained this and we would try it, but the 3 kids would need to come fed and ready for nap.

They wound up coming at 12:15.

During drop off (took 15 minutes) i found out the 3 year old doesn't nap. Mom telling me that the reason he was having a hard time was because the other daycare put him in a high chair to "cry it out" because he wouldn't nap there and it traumatized him . And that the other daycare also left 2 younger kids in pack and plays crying and made their 7 year old sibling care of them. I had to keep walking away and leaving her to try and settle and talk with dcb3 because I still had diapers I needed to change and get the other 4 kids down for nap.

The 3 year old boy cried his eyes out when mom finally left, and the 8 month and 19 months old actually did ok. Dcb3 took 10 minutes to settle.

As soon as I put the baby in the pack and play he cried. Was fine as long as I held him actually. Wound up having to put him in his car seat and rocking him until he fell asleep. 19 month old wouldn't say put on her cot, so I put her in the Pack and play. She also started crying. Dcb3 had actually fallen asleep on the couch during this time, so I left him there.

I had to get dcg19months next to me and sing (which I don't mind doing) her to sleep. Anytime I tried to take dc baby out of car seat he'd start crying, which lead me to have to rock him until he was asleep again.

Dcb3 slept all of nap time. The other 2 siblings slept for about an hour.

The rest of the day went good (for a first day) except that the 8 month baby had to be held or have me right next to him and within touching distance. Sometimes he'd be content if he was distracted to by a toy but other than that he'd cry. Anytime I pick him up he would immediately stop crying and paw and scratch me (not on purpose but his nails have never been cut so they are long) and be fine until I had to put him down to tend to other children. He is formula fed.

They also didn't bring any extra clothes and brought just enough diapers for the day. My policy states that each child must have one extra pair of clothes regardless of age.

When enrolling they told us that just after 5pm would be the normal pick up the rare occasion being almost 5:30pm. Dad didn't pull into my driveway until 5:33pm. 3 minutes passed closing.

I sent some questions to the family last night. Here are some of them and there answers:

What is your families nap and bed time routine? Do children get laid down in cribs/bed and they fall sleep on their own? Are they held or rocked or placed in a swing until they fall asleep?

-DCG19months sleeps in the crib. Dcb8months falls asleep either in the swing or on the bed.

What are the typical times that your kids go down for nap and bed time?

-didn't answer this question.

Do you baby-wear, co-sleep, or use a swing or bouncy at home? If so when? And typically for how long?

-I occasionally babywear, but he does co-sleep with me, uses a swing, and plays in a bouncer, and they are all rotated throughout the day when we're not playing.

I noticed today that dcb8months had a hard time being put down or being independent while I changed other children's diapers, that he would cry when I had to leave his side to help another child, or helped another child with potting. This could be just because he is in a new place and with someone different, and he should be fine in a few days of coming, but how is he at home topically in these circumstances?

-I'm sure that's what it is. They aren't around anybody else up here except our household. They've never met our extended family members or anything.


Today drop off was to be 9am (they're contracted time they put down were 8:30ish - 12:30ish and pick up time 5-5:30) but mom dropped off at 8:30am. My didn't bring extra clothes for dcb3. And there was only 1 diaper (the one I have left from yesterday) and it was saturated with water from something spelling in the diaper bag.

I called mom at 8:30 and told her that I needed diapers brought and I'd need extra clothes for dcb3 brought daily (this was the 2 time telling her this other then at interview) dad just dropped off 12 diapers for 2 children in diapers that are supposed to cover me until after 5 today (mom told me that both her and dad get off at 5 today).


How would you address these concerns and problems? Would you even bother continuing given that this is only day 2?

I'm guessing that kids sleep in and don't need naps at your naptime because of this. I always cover naps in interviews-I ask if the child still takes naps, I ask when they nap, how they put the child down for nap. I ask about bedtime and nighttime sleep hours, too.

About the diapers: Let them know that you need at least a week's supply of diapers on hand (I figure 30 diapers a week, to be safe). About the clothing: Bring them or your child won't be allowed in the door.

About the naps: That's up to you. You can try to insist that they get the kids up at a time that will allow them to nap at your home, or you can just deal with it. If you insist on naps, give them a deadline to get their schedule changed and have the kids napping.

Hearing about the "other daycare" traumatizing the kid and forcing the sib to provide care? That makes me think that this parent is going to be difficult to the extreme. How would a parent know what happened at daycare? Ask Mom what SHE thinks you should do to ensure the kids go to sleep? Ask her what SHE is going to do to help them nap at your home. I'm thinking that this family is going to do ONLY what works for them until you kick them out and then YOU will be the daycare that "traumatized" their children.

I feel for you. :hug:

[Denali]

During the interview they told me that all children except for the seven-year-old asleep for nap. wasn't until yesterday, their first day, that I was told the three rolled doesn't nap.

I left out in the original post that at drop off today mom told me that Dcb3 was tired and that was why he was crying at drop off. Then he told us (dcb and myself) that he would need to lay down this morning and nap.

Yes I believe that their stories of the other daycare care mostly exaggerated. They have told me the name of the other daycare on a few occasions and this other daycare is licensed. So the other licensed daycare took the children without being vaccinated to state rags for them to be present.... ( for the family supply them with a doctors note and we're playing me for a fool when they told me that their children were fully vaccinated but then weren't) My gut to says I should I call them... I want to ask about the family... But don't think that would exactly be kosher.

I am not seeing much improvement at all today. I'm getting ready to do lunch and nap and we will see how Napa goes today. And then we will see how pick up goes this afternoon, mom told me that her and dad were off at five today.

[Denali]

At pick up dad was told to bring clothes for each child and my policies stated that. At drop off I asked mom if there was a pair of clothes for each child in the bag and she said yes. That she put them in this morning.

And thank you. My husband and I are going to have a long talk this weekend about the family and see if they are worth keeping.

[sahm1225]

your post is a little confusing. How old are the kids? Are they required to be vaccinated?

The 8 month old not sitting up would concern me. The not eating baby food yet isn't a big deal.

With what you've said so far, I would say they aren't a good fit. They have already dropped off with out sufficient supplies, 30 minutes early and picked up late AND it's only their second day,??

[Blackcat31]

your post is a little confusing. How old are the kids? Are they required to be vaccinated?

The 8 month old not sitting up would concern me. The not eating baby food yet isn't a big deal.

With what you've said so far, I would say they aren't a good fit. They have already dropped off with out sufficient supplies, 30 minutes early and picked up late AND it's only their second day,??

This is actually a second or updated thread.

Here is the first one with a bit more info

https://www.daycare.com/forum/showthread.php?t=83661

[Mom2Two]

The part where they blamed the old provider is a big red flag for me. They have obviously been less than truthful with you, they have some organization problems, and they take NO responsibility for it, blaming someone else instead.

I guess give them the week trial if you want, but they sound like a nightmare waiting to happen to me.

[Denali]

Right now the baby will not sleep unless rocked. So I'm pretty much decided that we will not be taking the 8 month old baby until he is more prepared for group care.

I have a 2 week trial period but frankly they are failing hard at. I do not understand how you can put clothes in a diaper bag and not realize there was only one diaper in it. Especially since I forgot to replace their wipes and they looked in the bag enough to realize that they needed to put another pack of wipes in the bag. They were 3 minutes late passed my closing. 30 minutes early today, and they were my first drop off today. I have it stated in my policies that if I don't have anyone scheduled that I'm closed. I was looking forward to my extra time with my kids this morning. They have now cut into my family time a total of 33 minutes.

They will have to do something special wonderful spectacular for my thought of today will be it to change.

How would you guys go about wording the term? Or telling them what needs to change for them to continue?

[MunchkinWrangler]

Right now the baby will not sleep unless rocked. So I'm pretty much decided that we will not be taking the 8 month old baby until he is more prepared for group care.

I have a 2 week trial period but frankly they are failing hard at. I do not understand how you can put clothes in a diaper bag and not realize there was only one diaper in it. Especially since I forgot to replace their wipes and they looked in the bag enough to realize that they needed to put another pack of wipes in the bag. They were 3 minutes late passed my closing. 30 minutes early today, and they were my first drop off today. I have it stated in my policies that if I don't have anyone scheduled that I'm closed. I was looking forward to my extra time with my kids this morning. They have now cut into my family time a total of 33 minutes.

They will have to do something special wonderful spectacular for my thought of today will be it to change.

How would you guys go about wording the term? Or telling them what needs to change for them to continue?

Everything you are stating are big NOPE's to me. I wouldn't hesitate to tell them exactly why you are terming. They were not truthful with you regarding pickup and drop off times, that to me is a huge issue as we have lives outside of our operating hours. The surprise non napping 3 year old and 8 month nap issues are deal breakers as well.

I would just say that the agreed upon items, start and end times and napping schedules were not what was advertised by them, the parents. You can't continue because you are not able to fit their needs. I wouldn't go into any of the other issues as they are things they just won't understand and it'll sound accusatory.

[Denali]

Update:

So over the weekend I sent the family a email telling them that I was ending services due to failure to follow policies and the late pick up. Explained that it just wasn't going to work out. They responded and basically begged for another chance. I agreed as long as they were going to follow the rules, because Friday the kids did much better, and the $1,800 more a month would be nice as long as they were good.

Monday they were not scheduled. DCM told me that "they would be here Tuesday around 12:30pm ready for nap, but she'd try really hard to get them here a little before then. And thurday they'd start being here before lunch."

She showed up at 11:30, no call, right as we were all sitting down for lunch, telling me that her kids would need lunch to...

I flat out told her that she needs to comunacate with me, wasn't expecting them to be here until 12-12:30 so I didn't have food ready for them. She gave me this lost "what do I do look" so dumb me, instead of saying "Get lost" (but nicer) told her I'd make more lunch since we were having PB&J anyway, but next time I'd be turning away at the door.

She left. Got kids sat down and made more lunch. Went to check diaper bag, no clothes for DCB(3yr) and only a shirt for DCG (19months). Baby was the only one that had a full set of clothes. And there was only 5 diapers that were to last me until after 5.

So I'm done at this point. I shouldn't have taken them at all after I had told them I was done. Stupid me and falling for thier BS. I was going to be terming at pick up. Called Child Care Assistance to check on letter and making sure I'm going to be getting paid if I term today. Explained what was going on, and asked if they had anything for me so I could tell the family at pick up how much they owe me.

Find out that "...They are not going to be getting child care assistance..." Due to CCA's talk with the other provider that the family left. The lady was very nice, very apologetic, and told me that she was sorry, she wished that there was something more that she could do...

I thanked her, told her that they (CCA) was awesome, and it was my fault for not waiting on a letter before I took them (I do understand that these families need care, but this is the 3rd time that this exact thing has happened), and hung up.

Called Mom: told her what was up. That they could finish the week as long as they brought cash now for Thursday and this week or she can pay me for the days that they came and pick up her children now. She asked me to text her how much she owed for the time they've been here and that she'd pay me when she came and got the kids.

I called my husband and have him head home so he's here when she comes, then I text her the amount they owe including the enrollment fees that CCA was no longer going to be paying for. Dcm shows up with dcd and I have the kids ready to go and start shuffling them out the door.

Surprisingly they behaved picking up and at first said that they should have CCA, that CCA was just waiting to hear from the other daycare. I Explain that I was just told that they, as of right now, did not have CCA, and I was told that CCA would not be paying for any care here. Confirmed with mom that she got my text about how much was owed. She said she did. No word or move to pay me. So I Told them that payment was due by close of business. Explained my child care assistance policies and if CCA did actually pay that they would be refunded, but right now the total amount was due by close of business today. As they were leaving they blamed at all on the other daycare for all this.

So, what I've learn, is that I'm done taking CCA families without something. I need the authorization letter
Or the family can pay me out of pocket a week at a time until I get the letter if they must have care right now, and I'll refund once I know I can bill CCA. And if they give me the whole "WaH! Child care is to expensive and we can't afford to pay you!" Than they can keep looking. >

Side note: the day before the family was to start, I did call CCA and was told that "You can expect to be paid for the care you provide."

[Leigh]

Update:

So over the weekend I sent the family a email telling them that I was ending services due to failure to follow policies and the late pick up. Explained that it just wasn't going to work out. They responded and basically begged for another chance. I agreed as long as they were going to follow the rules, because Friday the kids did much better, and the $1,800 more a month would be nice as long as they were good.

Monday they were not scheduled. DCM told me that "they would be here Tuesday around 12:30pm ready for nap, but she'd try really hard to get them here a little before then. And thurday they'd start being here before lunch."

She showed up at 11:30, no call, right as we were all sitting down for lunch, telling me that her kids would need lunch to...

I flat out told her that she needs to comunacate with me, wasn't expecting them to be here until 12-12:30 so I didn't have food ready for them. She gave me this lost "what do I do look" so dumb me, instead of saying "Get lost" (but nicer) told her I'd make more lunch since we were having PB&J anyway, but next time I'd be turning away at the door.

She left. Got kids sat down and made more lunch. Went to check diaper bag, no clothes for DCB(3yr) and only a shirt for DCG (19months). Baby was the only one that had a full set of clothes. And there was only 5 diapers that were to last me until after 5.

So I'm done at this point. I shouldn't have taken them at all after I had told them I was done. Stupid me and falling for thier BS. I was going to be terming at pick up. Called Child Care Assistance to check on letter and making sure I'm going to be getting paid if I term today. Explained what was going on, and asked if they had anything for me so I could tell the family at pick up how much they owe me.

Find out that "...They are not going to be getting child care assistance..." Due to CCA's talk with the other provider that the family left. The lady was very nice, very apologetic, and told me that she was sorry, she wished that there was something more that she could do...

I thanked her, told her that they (CCA) was awesome, and it was my fault for not waiting on a letter before I took them (I do understand that these families need care, but this is the 3rd time that this exact thing has happened), and hung up.

Called Mom: told her what was up. That they could finish the week as long as they brought cash now for Thursday and this week or she can pay me for the days that they came and pick up her children now. She asked me to text her how much she owed for the time they've been here and that she'd pay me when she came and got the kids.

I called my husband and have him head home so he's here when she comes, then I text her the amount they owe including the enrollment fees that CCA was no longer going to be paying for. Dcm shows up with dcd and I have the kids ready to go and start shuffling them out the door.

Surprisingly they behaved picking up and at first said that they should have CCA, that CCA was just waiting to hear from the other daycare. I Explain that I was just told that they, as of right now, did not have CCA, and I was told that CCA would not be paying for any care here. Confirmed with mom that she got my text about how much was owed. She said she did. No word or move to pay me. So I Told them that payment was due by close of business. Explained my child care assistance policies and if CCA did actually pay that they would be refunded, but right now the total amount was due by close of business today. As they were leaving they blamed at all on the other daycare for all this.

So, what I've learn, is that I'm done taking CCA families without something. I need the authorization letter
Or the family can pay me out of pocket a week at a time until I get the letter if they must have care right now, and I'll refund once I know I can bill CCA. And if they give me the whole "WaH! Child care is to expensive and we can't afford to pay you!" Than they can keep looking. >

Side note: the day before the family was to start, I did call CCA and was told that "You can expect to be paid for the care you provide."

:hug:

My assistance families must pay cash until I receive their award letter. There is little incentive to get their application in quickly when you're already providing care for free. When I bill assistance the first time, I will refund any overpayment. Many times, there is no overpayment because they missed the window for backdating 2 weeks.

[LysesKids]

Update:

So over the weekend I sent the family a email telling them that I was ending services due to failure to follow policies and the late pick up. Explained that it just wasn't going to work out. They responded and basically begged for another chance. I agreed as long as they were going to follow the rules, because Friday the kids did much better, and the $1,800 more a month would be nice as long as they were good.

Monday they were not scheduled. DCM told me that "they would be here Tuesday around 12:30pm ready for nap, but she'd try really hard to get them here a little before then. And thurday they'd start being here before lunch."

She showed up at 11:30, no call, right as we were all sitting down for lunch, telling me that her kids would need lunch to...

I flat out told her that she needs to comunacate with me, wasn't expecting them to be here until 12-12:30 so I didn't have food ready for them. She gave me this lost "what do I do look" so dumb me, instead of saying "Get lost" (but nicer) told her I'd make more lunch since we were having PB&J anyway, but next time I'd be turning away at the door.

She left. Got kids sat down and made more lunch. Went to check diaper bag, no clothes for DCB(3yr) and only a shirt for DCG (19months). Baby was the only one that had a full set of clothes. And there was only 5 diapers that were to last me until after 5.

So I'm done at this point. I shouldn't have taken them at all after I had told them I was done. Stupid me and falling for thier BS. I was going to be terming at pick up. Called Child Care Assistance to check on letter and making sure I'm going to be getting paid if I term today. Explained what was going on, and asked if they had anything for me so I could tell the family at pick up how much they owe me.

Find out that "...They are not going to be getting child care assistance..." Due to CCA's talk with the other provider that the family left. The lady was very nice, very apologetic, and told me that she was sorry, she wished that there was something more that she could do...

I thanked her, told her that they (CCA) was awesome, and it was my fault for not waiting on a letter before I took them (I do understand that these families need care, but this is the 3rd time that this exact thing has happened), and hung up.

Called Mom: told her what was up. That they could finish the week as long as they brought cash now for Thursday and this week or she can pay me for the days that they came and pick up her children now. She asked me to text her how much she owed for the time they've been here and that she'd pay me when she came and got the kids.

I called my husband and have him head home so he's here when she comes, then I text her the amount they owe including the enrollment fees that CCA was no longer going to be paying for. Dcm shows up with dcd and I have the kids ready to go and start shuffling them out the door.

Surprisingly they behaved picking up and at first said that they should have CCA, that CCA was just waiting to hear from the other daycare. I Explain that I was just told that they, as of right now, did not have CCA, and I was told that CCA would not be paying for any care here. Confirmed with mom that she got my text about how much was owed. She said she did. No word or move to pay me. So I Told them that payment was due by close of business. Explained my child care assistance policies and if CCA did actually pay that they would be refunded, but right now the total amount was due by close of business today. As they were leaving they blamed at all on the other daycare for all this.

So, what I've learn, is that I'm done taking CCA families without something. I need the authorization letter
Or the family can pay me out of pocket a week at a time until I get the letter if they must have care right now, and I'll refund once I know I can bill CCA. And if they give me the whole "WaH! Child care is to expensive and we can't afford to pay you!" Than they can keep looking. >

Side note: the day before the family was to start, I did call CCA and was told that "You can expect to be paid for the care you provide."

I've been told the same in past & never got paid... in fact when I had to call parent for a sick child pick up (first time provider in 2001), found out father wasn't working anymore... I called Mountain heart (WV subsidy) and got bitched out for checking up on a parent, Noooo, I was calling to have them get a sick baby and found out the father lied about his work. That was the first of 2 states that made me decide not to take vouchers again (the other was Indiana). I do not regret my decision and it's been 12 years.

[Mike]

These parents are desperate and won't give up. Guess they better get desperate somewhere else. ::

[Denali]

So no surprise, they didn't show to pay me. My late payment policy is $25 per day (including weekends and holidays) until payment, including all fees, has been made. First late payment fee is to be added to amount owed on payment due date if payment has not been made that day by close of business. So they now owe $358.00

I have it in my policies that If any money is owed after care is terminated that I will give one phone call in an attempt to collect it, after this attempt the parent will have 2 weeks (late payment fees will still be accruing during this time) to pay the outstanding amount including all fees. If there is no attempt to pay or any contact then a claim with the courts will be filed.

Would you bother taking them to court? Or just let it go and move on? Should I give them until Friday then call them? Or call tomorrow?

What would you say? I'm a pretty blunt person. "Hey DCM, didn't see you yesterday, don't forget to add the $25 late payment fee when you bring by payment today. And remember that this fee is per day. See you this afternoon. "