DCF Just Termed Without Notice

[Devastated]

I have to agree with this.

If you turn the tables and put yourself in the dcm place, how would you feel if it was your daughter being bitten?

I am sorry you are having to deal with this. I would just let it go.

Sadly, she did not bite until she was biten by another dcg. She stopped for months until she got bit by another dcg.

[Devastated]

Because of what I bolded in the quote above, I would not request a formal, paid termination notice. The child has been bitten multiple times, 1 time went unnoticed by you, and 1 time went without the parents being notified by you when you did know. Regardless of whether you were or were not trying to "hide" something, the parents probably perceive the lack of notification as such. I also feel the statement about the biting being in retaliation would sound like you are excusing your child's biting, and feel that they should as well, rather than trying to find a solution to the issue. I'd let it go.

No I am not trying to excuse my dd, I am just ußing the definition that I found on the web when I was trying to find solutions. When I read the different types of biters, she fit the "retaliation biter" definition. So truthful, I should of fouced some on getting him to stop stealing, pushing and hitting. He even pulled he hair this last week. (Which she did not retaliate in anyway except to scream stop it)

I blame dcd anyways, he insisted on dcb coming no matter what. Even when dcb did not feel good.

As for not finding the bit. I looked dcb over, I could not see any thing. He stopped crying. The bite was found in a location that I did not think to look. I was so upset when dcm texted. Sadly, my feelings did not translate over my reply text, as hard as I tried.

Like I said I had great communication with dcm. I was keeping dcm up to date with what was going on, how she was doing and the research that I found was applying. I even went as far as getting dd a teething necklace.
But since dcd won't say more than a few words to me and I never saw dcm anymore, I droped the ball on updating them. They never knew that I was trying different things or how it was going.

[daycare]

Sadly, she did not bite until she was biten by another dcg. She stopped for months until she got bit by another dcg.

I understand this, however looking at it from this mothers perspective, I don't blame her for not wanting to send the child back there to possibly get bitten again. Doesnt matter who did it, what matters is that it was not being taken care of in the right way to be stopped and her child was not safe.

[Unregistered]

I never understand why some parents get so upset about a bite from another child?? I have been doing daycare for over 20 years (infants and toddlers) and, while I have fortunately only had a couple of biters in my 10 years of doing home daycare (and also had understanding parents while working thru this issue with these kids), when I worked in daycare centers it was rare that a day went by without a child being bitten in the toddler room. Some kids are biters. Unfortunately, that is how some express their frustration at this age. It's a phase and perfectly normal (unacceptable, but normal) toddler behavior. A child that bites is not a bad child. They just need to be watched carefully and taught a different way to communicate and handle their frustration.

Not once have I ever seen a child have a serious reaction or require medical treatment from being bitten by another child. Does it hurt? It really, really does but they are fine a few minutes later. While obviously it is possible for a child to be bitten severely enough that medical attention is required that is not usually the case. It's over and forgotten within minutes for them yet some parents are just outraged by it! I think having your toddler bitten by another toddler occasionally when in a daycare setting is something you have to accept is going to happen.

[Thriftylady]

I never understand why some parents get so upset about a bite from another child?? I have been doing daycare for over 20 years (infants and toddlers) and, while I have fortunately only had a couple of biters in my 10 years of doing home daycare (and also had understanding parents while working thru this issue with these kids), when I worked in daycare centers it was rare that a day went by without a child being bitten in the toddler room. Some kids are biters. Unfortunately, that is how some express their frustration at this age. It's a phase and perfectly normal (unacceptable, but normal) toddler behavior. A child that bites is not a bad child. They just need to be watched carefully and taught a different way to communicate and handle their frustration.

Not once have I ever seen a child have a serious reaction or require medical treatment from being bitten by another child. Does it hurt? It really, really does but they are fine a few minutes later. While obviously it is possible for a child to be bitten severely enough that medical attention is required that is not usually the case. It's over and forgotten within minutes for them yet some parents are just outraged by it! I think having your toddler bitten by another toddler occasionally when in a daycare setting is something you have to accept is going to happen.

Bites that break skin can be very serious. Yes they happen, but they can be serious. And quite frankly for a child to be bitten over and over by another child is abuse. No, it isn't the adult doing it, but it is still abusive if it isn't stopped. There is no difference in an adult abusing a child and another child doing it IMHO. And the reason why the child is biting doesn't really matter, unless that reason can be used to stop it. I would be very upset if my child was bitten four times and noting seemed to be helping, and I would pull my child for their safety. One bite or maybe two I could understand. It does make it harder if the providers child is doing the biting, because you can't very well term your own child.

[Unregistered]

Bites that break skin can be very serious. Yes they happen, but they can be serious. And quite frankly for a child to be bitten over and over by another child is abuse. No, it isn't the adult doing it, but it is still abusive if it isn't stopped. There is no difference in an adult abusing a child and another child doing it IMHO. And the reason why the child is biting doesn't really matter, unless that reason can be used to stop it. I would be very upset if my child was bitten four times and noting seemed to be helping, and I would pull my child for their safety. One bite or maybe two I could understand. It does make it harder if the providers child is doing the biting, because you can't very well term your own child.

Abuse?? Toddler on toddler abuse?

I currently have 3 toddlers in my care. One has a problem with pushing. Pushes the other kids multiple times every single day (often for no apparent reason and sometimes really hard). I have another that hits. With his hands or he will just whack someone with whatever toy happens to be in his hand. The 3rd just likes to follow the others around and steal whatever they are playing with and run away. All of these things would certainly be considered abusive...if they weren't toddlers! But they are toddlers and these are all normal behaviors in a toddler. We have to teach them and work with them not to do these things but it doesn't happen over night. It takes time and patience.

Biting is also normal behavior for some toddlers. It is unusual, in my experience, that a child bites just occasionally. Either a kid is a biter or they're not. What makes one kid a biter but not another I don't know but it is what it is and it could just as easily be your child doing the biting. The child that bites another child is not being abusive to that child anymore than the child that hits or pushes another child. They are just being toddlers. They have yet to learn that these are not appropriate ways to handle themselves.

This child was bitten 4 times in 2 months. That is not excessive to me. A child that is going thru a biting phase and spends his/her day with other similarly aged children will likely try to bite multiple times every single day! If your child is comes home with 4 bites in a day or a week then yeah, your provider is not on top of the situation but if your going to put your toddler in a place with other toddlers they may come home with a bite now and then.

Biting is not a fun phase for anyone involved but it really isn't as big of a deal as some people make it out to be and it isn't so easy to stop. But, bites don't usually break the skin and even when they do it is highly unlikely to be serious or require any more attention then some TLC.

It could just as easily be your child doing the biting...What then?

[Rockgirl]

Abuse?? Toddler on toddler abuse?

I currently have 3 toddlers in my care. One has a problem with pushing. Pushes the other kids multiple times every single day (often for no apparent reason and sometimes really hard). I have another that hits. With his hands or he will just whack someone with whatever toy happens to be in his hand. The 3rd just likes to follow the others around and steal whatever they are playing with and run away. All of these things would certainly be considered abusive...if they weren't toddlers! But they are toddlers and these are all normal behaviors in a toddler. We have to teach them and work with them not to do these things but it doesn't happen over night. It takes time and patience.

Biting is also normal behavior for some toddlers. It is unusual, in my experience, that a child bites just occasionally. Either a kid is a biter or they're not. What makes one kid a biter but not another I don't know but it is what it is and it could just as easily be your child doing the biting. The child that bites another child is not being abusive to that child anymore than the child that hits or pushes another child. They are just being toddlers. They have yet to learn that these are not appropriate ways to handle themselves.

This child was bitten 4 times in 2 months. That is not excessive to me. A child that is going thru a biting phase and spends his/her day with other similarly aged children will likely try to bite multiple times every single day! If your child is comes home with 4 bites in a day or a week then yeah, your provider is not on top of the situation but if your going to put your toddler in a place with other toddlers they may come home with a bite now and then.

Biting is not a fun phase for anyone involved but it really isn't as big of a deal as some people make it out to be and it isn't so easy to stop. But, bites don't usually break the skin and even when they do it is highly unlikely to be serious or require any more attention then some TLC.

It could just as easily be your child doing the biting...What then?

If my child had been bitten 4 times (I definitely consider that repeatedly), it would certainly be a big deal to me. Sure, as providers we know that it is developmentally normal, but as a parent, that would be of little comfort to me. Our children depend on us to protect them. I wouldn't keep sending them back to a place where I knew there was a good chance they'd be bitten again.

[Thriftylady]

Abuse?? Toddler on toddler abuse?

I currently have 3 toddlers in my care. One has a problem with pushing. Pushes the other kids multiple times every single day (often for no apparent reason and sometimes really hard). I have another that hits. With his hands or he will just whack someone with whatever toy happens to be in his hand. The 3rd just likes to follow the others around and steal whatever they are playing with and run away. All of these things would certainly be considered abusive...if they weren't toddlers! But they are toddlers and these are all normal behaviors in a toddler. We have to teach them and work with them not to do these things but it doesn't happen over night. It takes time and patience.

ETA: I just watched a news story a bit ago about people double dipping at parties and such. They discussed how it transfers things from SARS to salmonella. Bodily fluids can carry illness and disease and a bite that breaks the skin potentially gives these things a path right into the body.

Biting is also normal behavior for some toddlers. It is unusual, in my experience, that a child bites just occasionally. Either a kid is a biter or they're not. What makes one kid a biter but not another I don't know but it is what it is and it could just as easily be your child doing the biting. The child that bites another child is not being abusive to that child anymore than the child that hits or pushes another child. They are just being toddlers. They have yet to learn that these are not appropriate ways to handle themselves.

This child was bitten 4 times in 2 months. That is not excessive to me. A child that is going thru a biting phase and spends his/her day with other similarly aged children will likely try to bite multiple times every single day! If your child is comes home with 4 bites in a day or a week then yeah, your provider is not on top of the situation but if your going to put your toddler in a place with other toddlers they may come home with a bite now and then.

Biting is not a fun phase for anyone involved but it really isn't as big of a deal as some people make it out to be and it isn't so easy to stop. But, bites don't usually break the skin and even when they do it is highly unlikely to be serious or require any more attention then some TLC.

It could just as easily be your child doing the biting...What then?

Yes, it is abusive if it is hurting a child repeatedly. I see no difference in my hitting a child and hurting him and another child doing the same thing. Sure kids have spats, and as long as we deal with them and it doesn't keep happening that is fine. But when it keeps happening it becomes abusive. I do feel for the provider, because it isn't easy to deal with a biter. But I also think that by terming the parents did what they felt they needed to do to protect their child, which is their job. Should they have communicated with the provider about it? Yes, for sure they should have. But those are two different issues.

[Alwaysgreener]

I just been termed by a DCF, with out notice and they do not want to give me one either.

My dd bit dcb a four times during a 2 month period, she bit in retaliation to him stealing a toy from her or hitting her. One time I did not see the bite another time, I was distracted at pick up and got interrupted when I want to tell them.
I was always honest with how and why it happened.

DCM recently had surgery and been home while DCB comes. DCM has not been able to pick DCB up for a few weeks and he knows she is home. DCM says DCB has gotten more aggressive. DCM says DCB is getting more aggressive. DCB is true boy (not sure how to word that) but he climbs, plays in the dirt, he dumps things, he strong (upper body, He plays tug of war with his family's dog) -- he is a real boy type. I did not see anything wrong with his "aggression", he was just being a boy. He was not hurting any one.

Last time she bit was before Thanksgiving but did not leave until today. They kept bringing him for full days even though dcm was home and off restrictions. I sent him home when he was not feelong well and DCD still wanted him to come the next day.

This is the 4th family this year. One DCM lost her job, another DCF I termed, Drop in that contract expired and now this one.

Ugh. I am so upset. This DCB, I looked forward to coming and missed him when he was not here. I even had gotten him a gift for Christmas.


How did you feel after a DCF termed you?
Should I push the no notice, since my dd was the biter?

I understand this, however looking at it from this mothers perspective, I don't blame her for not wanting to send the child back there to possibly get bitten again. Doesnt matter who did it, what matters is that it was not being taken care of in the right way to be stopped and her child was not safe.

OP states that DCM was at home but they continued to send the child on and off after the last bite, which was before Thanksgiving.

If my child was getting hurt, I would end care right then.

So it makes me wonder :confused: , why they kept coming back, especially if DCM was at home.

As Judge Judy would say "if it was so bad, why did you keep taking him there?"

I agree with BC. You probably won't have a leg to stand on to push the notice period.

How did you not see a bite? The child didn't cry? As a parent I would be LIVID that it happened numerous times. I probably would have termed without notice the first time my child was sent home with a bite mark- without the provider even TELLING me!

Honestly this happen to me once, a bite happened and the child cried. When I asked what happen, I was told xx bit xx on the shoulder. I looked the shoulder over and could not find a thing. I told mom that xx admitted to biting her child but I could not find the bite. The next day, she came in and showed me a bruise, oval shaped that she found on the childs shoulder. There was no teeth marks, dcm even agreed.
Also, he did not cry for long, as soon as I gave him a hug he stopped, he never held his shoulder either.

[Thriftylady]

OP states that DCM was at home but they continued to send the child on and off after the last bite, which was before Thanksgiving.

If my child was getting hurt, I would end care right then.

So it makes me wonder :confused: , why they kept coming back, especially if DCM was at home.

As Judge Judy would say "if it was so bad, why did you keep taking him there?"







Honestly this happen to me once, a bite happened and the child cried. When I asked what happen, I was told xx bit xx on the shoulder. I looked the shoulder over and could not find a thing. I told mom that xx admitted to biting her child but I could not find the bite. The next day, she came in and showed me a bruise, oval shaped that she found on the childs shoulder. There was no teeth marks, dcm even agreed.
Also, he did not cry for long, as soon as I gave him a hug he stopped, he never held his shoulder either.

I agree with you about them sending the child back. I also said the parents shouldn't have just quit with no notice or communication. The parents handled this wrong for sure in every way. I see this as two different issues. We don't know for sure they quit over the biting, because they never discussed it. BUT the biting does need to somehow be stopped. And it is harder as the providers own child because you can't term your own child.

[Blackcat31]

OP states that DCM was at home but they continued to send the child on and off after the last bite, which was before Thanksgiving.

If my child was getting hurt, I would end care right then.

So it makes me wonder :confused: , why they kept coming back, especially if DCM was at home.

As Judge Judy would say "if it was so bad, why did you keep taking him there?"
.

Maybe they didn't leave because of the biting itself but left over the way the provider handled it.

She seemed to be defending her child alot and elaborated on all the bad things DCB did to her child.
She even blamed DCD for poor communication.
She also admitted to being distracted at pickup and not telling the parents about a bite that happened.
She also says she dropped the ball on keeping parents apprised of the situation and what she was doing about it.

Sounds like the provider may be the reason they left.

[Unregistered]

Yes, it is abusive if it is hurting a child repeatedly. I see no difference in my hitting a child and hurting him and another child doing the same thing. Sure kids have spats, and as long as we deal with them and it doesn't keep happening that is fine. But when it keeps happening it becomes abusive. I do feel for the provider, because it isn't easy to deal with a biter. But I also think that by terming the parents did what they felt they needed to do to protect their child, which is their job. Should they have communicated with the provider about it? Yes, for sure they should have. But those are two different issues.

You really see no difference between an adult hitting a child and a toddler hitting another toddler?

[Unregistered]

I sympathize with you. :hug:
My child was a biter too (18 month at the time).
It took about a month to stop the behavior. During that time, he was removed from any space where he could bite one of the daycare children. Whether it was with Dad, on me (lap or carrier) or in a pack n' play.

Personally, if it were me, I'd let them leave without the two week notice.

In the future, if it ever happens with another child, I'd suggest having a conference with the parents and letting them know YOU have a plan in place, what it is and how you plan to protect their child. Although biting may be normal to US, it's usually not seen as normal or acceptable to our clients/parents. All they see (and rightfully so) is that their child got hurt in your care.

Bitting isn't normal or acceptable behavior, though. At the age children bite (have enough teeth to bite) they should be able to talk. I.e. Say "Mine!" and pull a toy away instead of getting their toy taken away and bitting back. Most children who bite are nonverbal and/or special needs. I'm noticed 9 times out of 10, people who are ok with bitting usually were or their children are/were. My old boss used to get pissed at me when I would say bitting isn't a good sign and I later found out her son was a bitter.

[Unregistered]

Bites that break skin can be very serious. Yes they happen, but they can be serious. And quite frankly for a child to be bitten over and over by another child is abuse. No, it isn't the adult doing it, but it is still abusive if it isn't stopped. There is no difference in an adult abusing a child and another child doing it IMHO. And the reason why the child is biting doesn't really matter, unless that reason can be used to stop it. I would be very upset if my child was bitten four times and noting seemed to be helping, and I would pull my child for their safety. One bite or maybe two I could understand. It does make it harder if the providers child is doing the biting, because you can't very well term your own child.

I've seen MULTIPLE cases where children bite other children (sometimes younger children bitting older before/after care children) and make them bleed. Also, some children won't let go. I have a four year old ESL student like this. He learned through violence (he wasn't only a biter) he could get his way at home. One day I had enough of it and but him in time out for pushing a little girl on the floor for taking "his" seat. He bite me. Me being me, I pretended it didn't hurt and tried to pull him off. He twisted my skin and literally bit a piece of skin off of my hand. It wouldn't stop bleeding and I had to get stitches. Some children literally bite like a dog. I can only imagine how he could have hurt other children.

[Rockgirl]

Bitting isn't normal or acceptable behavior, though. At the age children bite (have enough teeth to bite) they should be able to talk. I.e. Say "Mine!" and pull a toy away instead of getting their toy taken away and bitting back. Most children who bite are nonverbal and/or special needs. I'm noticed 9 times out of 10, people who are ok with bitting usually were or their children are/were. My old boss used to get pissed at me when I would say bitting isn't a good sign and I later found out her son was a bitter.

I haven't found this to necessarily true, in my experience. Children do lash out in frustration, even if they are able to say "Mine". That doesn't mean I have excused it, of course. When it has happened here, I have removed all opportunities for the child to bite again. They became my shadow after one biting incident.