Carseat Death

[Unregistered]

I just had an incident where a child was dropped of and within a minute of shutting the door I noticed she was acting like something was wrong with her leg. I started making a video of it less than 5 minutes after she arrived because I didn't want to call the parents only to have them arrive and have the child acting fine (at first I thought maybe she just wanted me to carry her or was grumpy). I called the parents a minute after the video was done. The parent showed up about 15 minutes later even though they'd just left and at first said the child was fine at drop off until I mentioned that I had a video that was time stamped as starting almost immediately after drop off. Then I was told the child was acting like something was wrong with her leg since they picked up from my home the day previously.
I knew it wasn't true, for one thing she hadn't gotten hurt here, had walked to the door herself at pick up and no good parent would ever let their child be in the pain this child seemed to be in all night without taking her to the doctor and bring her to daycare the next day without saying a word. I felt I had myself covered by was really seeing my life flash before my eyes. They took her to the doctor and it ended up being a virus that causes joint pain in toddlers. Now I'm installing 4 cameras with recording straight to DVR to protect myself thanks to the advice of a veteran provider. That feeling of wondering if these people had just ruined my life because they didn't want to take responsibility for something that happened at home was eye opening.

Smart thing to do, but no parent is ever going to wreck your life. Certainly not mine. Aside from doing what you're suppose to the other best protection is lot's of good insurance. Sad but with all the money grubbers, people looking to cash in, documenting and great insurance is your best bet. Oh and I will bet in this case, they didn't want to pay the co-pay. I've had these people before, they avoid the doctor like the plague because of co-pays.

[nanglgrl]

Smart thing to do, but no parent is ever going to wreck your life. Certainly not mine. Aside from doing what you're suppose to the other best protection is lot's of good insurance. Sad but with all the money grubbers, people looking to cash in, documenting and great insurance is your best bet. Oh and I will bet in this case, they didn't want to pay the co-pay. I've had these people before, they avoid the doctor like the plague because of co-pays.

Tell that to the providers in Kern County, California in the 1980s or the owners of McMartin Preschool in the 1980's. The events in the 1980s and 1990s ruined a lot of innocent people's lives.
I have liability insurance for the daycare.
I think they could most definitely wreck my life. If the child had actually been found to have an injury it could have been a he said/she said. That could definitely ruin my life. People are way more suspicious of a daycare provider than they are the child's parents when it comes to these situations. I know a provider who had a daycare child injured by being shaken. The baby was in care that day and fussier than normal but it wasn't until that night after being picked up that the baby had seizures. The baby is now blind and has brain damage. The provider was drug through the mud. After months had passed it was discovered the child had been shaken before daycare that day but the provider doesnt do daycare any longer., I don't blame her. She was lucky that her dad is an attorney.
Even if a provider is cleared of all wrong doing there are still a lot of people who are suspicious and one of my biggest fears is for people to think I hurt a child followed by being charged with a crime. It would be a level of hell for me to put my family through all that suspicion, to deal with other parents at my children's schools who thought I was a child abuser.
Luckily I reacted quickly and took the video and the parents were late so they text me on their way (and also lucky the child wasn't actually injured). These things created a timeline where the child wouldn't have really had time to be injured in care. It was really luck because if they hadn't been running late I wouldn't have that text and because they were running late everyone else had already arrived so I wasn't dealing with the hustle and bustle I normally have at arrival and I had enough time to think of documenting what I was seeing.
I know what you're talking about with the parents and co pays but these parents don't have that problem.
We're all only an accident, a misinterpretation, a crazy parent, an overzealous investigation or a misled prosecutor away from what most of us would consider hell.
We can document of course but even great documentation is no guarantee.

[Sugar Magnolia]

Smart thing to do, but no parent is ever going to wreck your life. Certainly not mine. Aside from doing what you're suppose to the other best protection is lot's of good insurance. Sad but with all the money grubbers, people looking to cash in, documenting and great insurance is your best bet. Oh and I will bet in this case, they didn't want to pay the co-pay. I've had these people before, they avoid the doctor like the plague because of co-pays.

"Certainly not mine". That's a pretty bold statement. I'm glad you have that confidence.

[Sugar Magnolia]

of course it gives all unregistered and unlicensed caregivers a bad rap. not just the illegal ones. generalized sweeping statements or untrue or half true statements hurt everyone. even those that are providing quality care as unlicensed or unregistered.
just like not all centers are bad

Calling all LEGALLY unlicensed or LEGALLY unregistered members to chime in. Do you feel this incident gives you a bad name? I do not feel that way. I fully support my legally unlicensed brother and sisters who provide safe, quality care, day in and day out. Looking for a solid reason from unregistered on exactly HOW this incident gives those who DO follow the laws a bad rap.

I DO feel this incident gives ILLEGAL providers a serious black eye, as it should, because illegal is illegal is illegal. Those who care for childrem should follow the laws of their state. Period. If that position is the " sweeping generalizations " I am being accused of making, so be it. But if you cool with providers operating illegally......good for you a baby is dead.

"Like all centers are not bad".....ok....thanks for the tip on who this unregistered comment is from. Just another anonymous snipe, beautifully executed. Yeah, what an awful member I am, getting upset over illegal providers who put babies in car seats in closets. And toddlers walking out of A LICENSED CENTER play yard with four staff present.

I no longer feel welcomed here. Peace OUT. YOU WIN, unregistered, enjoy your forum

Blessings to all my fellow providers providing safe and loving care. Legally, of course.

[Thriftylady]

I am not sure I think it gives all unlicensed providers a bad name. I do know some parents think if you are licensed it is safer, but that just isn't true, and I try to educate people on that. I tell people a good provider is a good provider regardless, and so is a bad one. I guess I think it gives some parents a false sense of security.

[Unregistered]

"Certainly not mine". That's a pretty bold statement. I'm glad you have that confidence.

Really? I wasn't talking about something really horrific like that McMartin case, or other abuses of media, law, etc. or something way out of the norm.

As for illegal, not, what have you..it's a non issue imo because these things happen everywhere. It's a horrible accident as was ruled, all that can be done is continued education of parents and providers.

[Heidi]

Calling all LEGALLY unlicensed or LEGALLY unregistered members to chime in. Do you feel this incident gives you a bad name? I do not feel that way. I fully support my legally unlicensed brother and sisters who provide safe, quality care, day in and day out. Looking for a solid reason from unregistered on exactly HOW this incident gives those who DO follow the laws a bad rap.

I DO feel this incident gives ILLEGAL providers a serious black eye, as it should, because illegal is illegal is illegal. Those who care for childrem should follow the laws of their state. Period. If that position is the " sweeping generalizations " I am being accused of making, so be it. But if you cool with providers operating illegally......good for you a baby is dead.

"Like all centers are not bad".....ok....thanks for the tip on who this unregistered comment is from. Just another anonymous snipe, beautifully executed. Yeah, what an awful member I am, getting upset over illegal providers who put babies in car seats in closets. And toddlers walking out of A LICENSED CENTER play yard with four staff present.

I no longer feel welcomed here. Peace OUT. YOU WIN, unregistered, enjoy your forum

Blessings to all my fellow providers providing safe and loving care. Legally, of course.

You'd better not be leaving the rest of us behind because of some unregistered troll, Sugar!

Oh please don't go...we'll miss you so!

Seriously...don't go!

[nanglgrl]

Really? I wasn't talking about something really horrific like that McMartin case, or other abuses of media, law, etc. or something way out of the norm.

As for illegal, not, what have you..it's a non issue imo because these things happen everywhere. It's a horrible accident as was ruled, all that can be done is continued education of parents and providers.

There hasn't been a ruling just a cause of death the case was forwarded to the county attorney.

Any allegation against me be it satanic rituals and sexual abuse or being negligent to the degree it injured or led to the death of a child has the potential to ruin my life.

Sugar, please don't leave!

[nanglgrl]

No, it doesn't hurt ALL unregistered or unlicensed. Just the illegal ones. The operative word being illegal. I am very interested to know if this was an illegal operation. It matters. I do agree that the facts are limited here. I did not read closet anywhere either. If it's true, about the closet.....negligent homicide. Seriously. I need more facts. It bothers me to see the phrase "ruled accidental"' because it was no accident that a child care provider placed him in a car seat with the intent of the child napping. Being put in a closet is certainly not accidental.

Eta I didn't see the post about first hand knowledge of the closet. My mistake nangjrl sorry!

Sorry Sugar, I didn't see this post until now. It's no big deal! I know it hasn't been is some of the coverage!
As far as the daycare being legal..in Iowa providers are allowed to have 5 children of any age and be unregistered, on top of that they can have their own school aged children. This happened in the summer so the providers children were home. The reports said she had 9 children in care but didn't say if any of those were her own school age children. However she only had 3 children so she was definitely over by at least one making her illegal but possibly over by 4 children. In addition there are certain things unregistered are supposed to do the problem is since there is no oversite or education for them many don't even know they still have regulations. Being that DHS didn't even know her daycare existed I would imagine that she wasn't meeting the other regulations for an unregistered provider (on top of not meeting them because she had too many kids in care).

[racemom]

I think when things like this happen at in home daycare it hurts all of them, legal or not. The reasoning behind that statement is the majority of the public do not realize the difference between in home daycares. The majority of people only hear in home daycare and lump you all together. They don't know the regulations or rules you are under whether licensed or not, legal or illegal. It is all the same to most people.

But, people do the same with centers, and sadly I even see that on here, with comments like large staff turnover, uncaring staff, uneducated employees, etc. It is ironic how people will quickly turn on providers, but leave their precious children with us everyday!

[Gemma]

I no longer feel welcomed here. Peace OUT. YOU WIN, unregistered, enjoy your forum

Blessings to all my fellow providers providing safe and loving care. Legally, of course.

It is ok to disagree, to each their own opinion....please stay!:hug:

[Rockgirl]

Really? I wasn't talking about something really horrific like that McMartin case, or other abuses of media, law, etc. or something way out of the norm.

As for illegal, not, what have you..it's a non issue imo because these things happen everywhere. It's a horrible accident as was ruled, all that can be done is continued education of parents and providers.

I'd never call this an accident. Of course I don't believe the provider intended for the child to die. But she did intentionally (incorrectly) strap him into a car seat, and intentionally placed him in a closet.

[Little Learners]

[/B]

You know what I find interesting? The amount of risk many providers will allow, even those who "know better". Childcare is such a liability and with ANY daycare (licensed or not) the day to day risk factor is so high that I amazed anyone wants to do it at this point. I have been seriously considering giving it up (after 17 years), because even if I do everything right, I still hold so much liability and my life could be turned upside down in a matter of seconds. Not too mention the lives of my family members. My home town is dealing with a case where the provider took kids to the pool and a girl drowned. She is now facing negligent homicide. I am scared to my job for fear of making a terrible mistake one day and having the world crash in

I agree, blows my mind at some of the things I see others do. I know one in our area that doesn't have a fence around their built in pool, and does daycare. Others take the kids out, and that's something I wouldn't do but each to their own. Let's just say a pool outing is not something I would do of all things. As paranoid as I am, it's a fact there is a lot of liability but I guess once we leave our house each day (those that do) we face a ton of risk so you can look at it that way.

Just wondering did the provider lose sight of the child? Did she have any helpers for this outing?

[mommyneedsadayoff]

I agree, blows my mind at some of the things I see others do. I know one in our area that doesn't have a fence around their built in pool, and does daycare. Others take the kids out, and that's something I wouldn't do but each to their own. Let's just say a pool outing is not something I would do of all things. As paranoid as I am, it's a fact there is a lot of liability but I guess once we leave our house each day (those that do) we face a ton of risk so you can look at it that way.

Just wondering did the provider lose sight of the child? Did she have any helpers for this outing?

I am not sure of the specifics (there has been a lot of misinformation on this going around), but I believe she was with a helper. They were at a pool with two lifegaurds and from what I heard, the lifeguard is the one who spotted her at the bottom. The dcp was there, but must not have been paying attention or got distracted?

Really sad case and I am anxious to see how it plays out. The dcp is very well known in the community, so it is hitting a lot of people hard.

[Cat Herder]

Not the first time. Won't be the last.

This is why States are banning the use of restraint devices.

We've been discussing this exact scenario for more than 20 YEARS.

Different child, different provider, same lame excuse, same scenario.