My First Experience with the FCCRS

[daycare]

A 5.3 is excellent!!! Congrats.


I did it with 12 kids. Once you get the routine down, it won't be as big of an issue. We wash upon arrival, after toileting/diapering, after wiping nose, before and after each meal, upon returning from outside play, and any other time their hands might be messy - art, playdoh, etc.

We also wash and sanitize tables before and after each meal.

It's a pain. But like I said, once you get the routine down, you will be fine. And I can say that although it is a pain, we rarely have kids get sick and when they do, the illness typically doesn't go past one kid.

I am an avid hand-washer, I am actually a bit of a germ phobe, which is odd that I work with kids. BUT it's the amount of time that they are saying is required to wash hands is nuts.... I timed our hand-washing and for the entire day it was an hour and 35 minutes, that did not include when a child went to the bathroom one at a time.

It takes about 1 minute to wash and dry each childs hands x14 kids...... and the 1 min is moving fast......

[Annalee]

I am contracted with a state program and, as part of that program, they come out and complete a FCCRS every 6 months. My overall score was a 5.3, which they were happy with. However, in the subscores, they really nailed me in a few areas.

Apparently, my program is horribly unsanitary because we don't all wash our hands 15 times a day. Just for kicks, I calculated about how much time it would take to wash 14 kids hands as often as the FCCRS requires; it's 70 minutes. That doesn't count the fires I would be putting out while kids waited to wash hands.

My other dings were not having pictures of random multicultural people the kids don't know on the wall, (lots of other multicultural items/books) I permitted children to eat at the dining room table, (The kids table is in the classroom and the lady was irritated) and the lady decided that my space wasn't big enough for the number of children I am licensed floor. (I was floored by that)

This was my first experience but it was not positive. I did take away some feedback I'll use to improve my program but, to some degree, I felt like I was being nitpicked. Is it always like this.

In my state, providers must score a 4.0 to be on the FCCERS-R scale. All 5 components of our report card hinge on the assessment score so if we do not score a 4 or above we get an automatic "0". 4.0 - 4.4 is a star and 4.5 - 4.9 is another star and anything above 5 is considered bells and whistles so you did fine. It has been mandated/a law here to do this annually since 2001-02 but I think our report card here is in the process of being revamped Be proud of your score especially for the first time. Too much of the FCCERS-R is left to the assessor's perception of a certain situation and I find that to be the most frustrating. This leads to many inconsistencies and the provider being at the mercy of the assessor's score that will define us for a year. I generally score well, but find the process has become a game and is not doing what it set out to do....separate the good from the bad. There are providers who score low that don't deserve it and providers that score high that don't deserve it. Just my thoughts on this subject!

[snbauser]

I am an avid hand-washer, I am actually a bit of a germ phobe, which is odd that I work with kids. BUT it's the amount of time that they are saying is required to wash hands is nuts.... I timed our hand-washing and for the entire day it was an hour and 35 minutes, that did not include when a child went to the bathroom one at a time.

It takes about 1 minute to wash and dry each childs hands x14 kids...... and the 1 min is moving fast......

I know how long it takes. We wash 20 seconds and rinse 15 seconds every single time. The kids have to either sing out handwashing song 2 X when washing or sing the abc's. Then the rinsing song. I'm just saying it's long, it's frustrating, but it can be done with minimal issues once there is a routine.

[daycare]

I know how long it takes. We wash 20 seconds and rinse 15 seconds every single time. The kids have to either sing out handwashing song 2 X when washing or sing the abc's. Then the rinsing song. I'm just saying it's long, it's frustrating, but it can be done with minimal issues once there is a routine.

here ours is wet hands, scrub for 20 seconds (we have to turn the water off, drought) then rinse for 10. God forbid someone have to use the toilet during that time, add another 5 min to it....

[spedmommy4]

Today was a low day and I was by myself. I had 6 kids so I gave the constant handwashing a go. It was a nightmare. I gave up before lunch. Today I had my little one who pushes, a 20 month old, two very delayed 3 year olds that don't know how to wash hands, and two typical threes. Everytime we washed hands, chaos ensued. It's naptime and I'm ready to call it a day.

[snbauser]

here ours is wet hands, scrub for 20 seconds (we have to turn the water off, drought) then rinse for 10. God forbid someone have to use the toilet during that time, add another 5 min to it....

Ours is the same process except I bought an attachment for my sink that makes into a hands free sensor. The kids stick their hand under it and it goes on. When they take their hands out, it goes off. Saves a ton on my water bill and I don't need to worry about turning it on and off.

[daycare]

Today was a low day and I was by myself. I had 6 kids so I gave the constant handwashing a go. It was a nightmare. I gave up before lunch. Today I had my little one who pushes, a 20 month old, two very delayed 3 year olds that don't know how to wash hands, and two typical threes. Everytime we washed hands, chaos ensued. It's naptime and I'm ready to call it a day.

lately feel like all we do is clean and wash hands.....it really has taken a huge chunk of our preschool time out. We journal every week and this week we didn't get to finish and one parent asked why, before i could open my mouth their kid said because Miss N makes us wash our hands too much........ugh

I am with you.....in your feelings

[gameofthrones]

is that a program you have to participate in

[Laurel]

My licensing rep was here the other day and, although she expects me to give HER my undivided attentive while she's here, she still deducted because she saw two toddlers go use the bathroom and they didn't automatically wash their hands. I was like !! They're 2 year olds! I usually help them! But I couldn't because she was talking my head off and asking me questions about my files. Grrrrrrr.... So I was penalized for not having 4 hands.

What you might want to try in that situation is that when you see a child that needs help with something and she is yacking say "Oh my, little Susie needs me to help her wash her hands. Would you rather me help her or take care of this paperwork?" I used to do that when I worked as a secretary and the boss wanted two things done and I was the only one there. I asked him which was more important to do first because I could only do one at a time. I said it nicely and it worked.

Laurel

[spedmommy4]

is that a program you have to participate in

Yes and no. I accept children from a uniquie state subsidized program in my county in the state of California. I could refuse kids from this program but honestly I feel like California may be working towards requiring it so it is good practice. At the same time, it's insanely frustrating. I'm going to go find one of those fccers authors and invite them to sub for me for the day.i doubt the experts could get all this hand washing done perfectly with large groups of littles either.

[gameofthrones]

Yes and no. I accept children from a uniquie state subsidized program in my county in the state of California. I could refuse kids from this program but honestly I feel like California may be working towards requiring it so it is good practice. At the same time, it's insanely frustrating. I'm going to go find one of those fccers authors and invite them to sub for me for the day.i doubt the experts could get all this hand washing done perfectly with large groups of littles either.

Thanks for answering. I too am in California so I guess I should do my research

[Abigail]

I am contracted with a state program and, as part of that program, they come out and complete a FCCRS every 6 months. My overall score was a 5.3, which they were happy with. However, in the subscores, they really nailed me in a few areas.

Apparently, my program is horribly unsanitary because we don't all wash our hands 15 times a day. Just for kicks, I calculated about how much time it would take to wash 14 kids hands as often as the FCCRS requires; it's 70 minutes. That doesn't count the fires I would be putting out while kids waited to wash hands.

My other dings were not having pictures of random multicultural people the kids don't know on the wall, (lots of other multicultural items/books) I permitted children to eat at the dining room table, (The kids table is in the classroom and the lady was irritated) and the lady decided that my space wasn't big enough for the number of children I am licensed floor. (I was floored by that)

This was my first experience but it was not positive. I did take away some feedback I'll use to improve my program but, to some degree, I felt like I was being nitpicked. Is it always like this.

You have 14 kids? Do you have 1 or 2 helpers? We have 11 kids and I have two helpers here for when we have observations. Since I'm the owner I help a little here and there to keep chaos at a minimum and the girls each have their own daily duties of what we're doing throughout the day. I'm only required one helper, but I'll be on maternity leave this summer so I've got two here full time for now and plan to keep them both because a newborn in the house again and nursing will be very time consuming!

We did our "practice" observation last month and sometime this month we'll have our real one. We have to get a 4.0 and we scored 4.something but all my previous scores have been 5. somethings. We got docked a lot on infants because I had one infant under 12 months with a blanket in their bed, which is allowed but not for fccers so I have to remember to eliminate that before our next observation. We even have a permission slip for licensing proving it's ok, but fccers goes by current best practice not licensing standards. We also got docked because I greet parents as they drop off and we're having breakfast so I stand at the doorway between hallway and kitchen to have my morning hellos and got docked because I was not within an arms reach of the almost one year old infant. That dinged me in two categories because of meal time not being safe even though I was only a few feet away and also because of poor supervision............stupid things can get you twice! I was told at my review to make sure if I'm serving breakfast that I need to let my helper know I will not leave the room, not even just to the doorway, while the almost one year old has a bottle or food they're eating. If they're just buckled in the highchair for a moment before/after food it's okay.

We also got docked on wait time. Since we have a large group and all went outside we had to dress in shoes and a warm coat and hat. We all start getting ready at the same time, all three teachers total and 11 kids. Since the start time and end time was more than three minutes total it was too long to wait. So next time we're splitting into groups of you take these four and go get ready and go outside, etc. ORRRRR she said if we are all getting ready I need to verbally tell the kids when they are ready or waiting for help to get ready that they can do "this or this" like reading a book or doing a puzzle or wait quietly if they don't want to read or do a puzzle. This way they're not being told to sit and wait. I always say they can read a book and wait in the library but I guess that wasn't enough options. At least my next observation soon will probably only require shoes and no coats!

Hand washing, I require parents to wash their childs hands when they drop off and it's been this way for 2 years. Only exception is with young infants I wait to have the parents start washing until they're eating solids for breakfast (or about that time). During transition times we never have kids lined up in the hall or bathroom waiting. Before lunch the kids are in playroom and wash one at a time as I call them so when one is almost done I call the next. Someone is usually reading a book right before lunch so they're not waiting yet not playing with everything. Babies get washed and put in high chairs first so they're done then it's just 8 1-4 year olds. We don't have kids go potty before lunch unless they say they have too, we wait til afterwards or else technically we have to sanitize the sink to make it a "clean sink" before washing our hands for lunch. With observations we announce a bit before lunch if anyone has to go potty to avoid the holdup of cleaning the sink again. Kids always wash after lunch as well. We always wash after art activities and we always wash everytime we come inside. It's just been a habit and kids get use to it.

[MarinaVanessa]

I wouldn't give it another thought. There's no way that even with a large daycare of 12 kids and 2 adults you'll be able to do everything on the lists. Somethings I refused to do anyway so I'll take the low score.

Some of my "centers" are outside so I got dinged for not having everything inside . The only way to get everything they expect me to have inside is if I get rid of my couches, entertainment center and dining room table ... leaving me with absolutely no adult size furniture downstairs. Yeah, no.

Another one for me was that my changing table isn't next to a sink. It's across the living room and bathroom because that's the only place it will fit. My downstairs bathroom is seriously like 5 x 7 and only has room for a toilet and a sink. They wanted me to move the entertainment center which is next to the bathroom and place my changing table there. That means that my TV would have to go next to my couch (on the same wall) so what then? My family can't watch TV then unless we stand in front of it since we can't see the TV if we sit down

I just told the lady that I'd be more than happy to take the low score because I wasn't interested in doing all that. No one's got time for all that ::

[spedmommy4]

I have one assistant, but I only have 14 kids during the summer. (We accept two Kinders during the summer) I have a master's in early childhood special ed, and I felt much of what was considered "best practice" is absurd.

I will pick on excessive hand washing to start with. The FCCERS recommends far more handwashing and sanitizing than the centers for disease control. I am no expert, but I assume the CDC has quite a few of them. I am fine with following the CDC recommendations. I am not fine with hand washing twice as much as the CDC recommends. To some degree, germs help kids develop a healthy immune system. I don't ever remember washing my hands this much as a kid and I never get sick now. We don't need to protect kids from ALL germs and ALL dirt. To boot, all the hand washing creates sooo much wait time during the day. And then the observers complain about kids having to wait? What???

And then there is the idea that kids should never have to wait. Kids should learn to wait. It's okay to wait. I can't have a conversation with most of my parents because as soon as the parents arrive, the child will engage in behaviors. I do teach kids to wait. It is a very important skill to learn, and we do children a terrible disservice by not teaching them. (And by entertaining them every moment) Further, I am one person with two hands. Short of having a personal assistant, children will occasionally wait in group care situations. It doesn't scar them for life.

I personally got dinged for not having enough of the kids art on the wall. My current group ALWAYS insists on taking their art home. (With the exception of one or two kids) No way am I going to say, "I am sorry dcg, but the FCCERS says I must keep 3 pieces of your art for display." It bugs me to no end that there are NO exceptions to their "standards."

The other one I got dinged on was not having enough soft toys. I have plenty but I don't put them out anymore. My current group isn't into them. I have tried a variety but they just don't play with them. I had a few a the time of observation and the kids didn't touch them but, it was another one of those situations where the FCCERS dings you for some arbitrary number of items over actual quality.

As a tool, I think the FCCERS is fine. Unfortunately, it seems to be held up as the gold standard for home childcare and it just has a long way to go before it gets to "gold standard."

You have 14 kids? Do you have 1 or 2 helpers? We have 11 kids and I have two helpers here for when we have observations. Since I'm the owner I help a little here and there to keep chaos at a minimum and the girls each have their own daily duties of what we're doing throughout the day. I'm only required one helper, but I'll be on maternity leave this summer so I've got two here full time for now and plan to keep them both because a newborn in the house again and nursing will be very time consuming!

We did our "practice" observation last month and sometime this month we'll have our real one. We have to get a 4.0 and we scored 4.something but all my previous scores have been 5. somethings. We got docked a lot on infants because I had one infant under 12 months with a blanket in their bed, which is allowed but not for fccers so I have to remember to eliminate that before our next observation. We even have a permission slip for licensing proving it's ok, but fccers goes by current best practice not licensing standards. We also got docked because I greet parents as they drop off and we're having breakfast so I stand at the doorway between hallway and kitchen to have my morning hellos and got docked because I was not within an arms reach of the almost one year old infant. That dinged me in two categories because of meal time not being safe even though I was only a few feet away and also because of poor supervision............stupid things can get you twice! I was told at my review to make sure if I'm serving breakfast that I need to let my helper know I will not leave the room, not even just to the doorway, while the almost one year old has a bottle or food they're eating. If they're just buckled in the highchair for a moment before/after food it's okay.

We also got docked on wait time. Since we have a large group and all went outside we had to dress in shoes and a warm coat and hat. We all start getting ready at the same time, all three teachers total and 11 kids. Since the start time and end time was more than three minutes total it was too long to wait. So next time we're splitting into groups of you take these four and go get ready and go outside, etc. ORRRRR she said if we are all getting ready I need to verbally tell the kids when they are ready or waiting for help to get ready that they can do "this or this" like reading a book or doing a puzzle or wait quietly if they don't want to read or do a puzzle. This way they're not being told to sit and wait. I always say they can read a book and wait in the library but I guess that wasn't enough options. At least my next observation soon will probably only require shoes and no coats!

Hand washing, I require parents to wash their childs hands when they drop off and it's been this way for 2 years. Only exception is with young infants I wait to have the parents start washing until they're eating solids for breakfast (or about that time). During transition times we never have kids lined up in the hall or bathroom waiting. Before lunch the kids are in playroom and wash one at a time as I call them so when one is almost done I call the next. Someone is usually reading a book right before lunch so they're not waiting yet not playing with everything. Babies get washed and put in high chairs first so they're done then it's just 8 1-4 year olds. We don't have kids go potty before lunch unless they say they have too, we wait til afterwards or else technically we have to sanitize the sink to make it a "clean sink" before washing our hands for lunch. With observations we announce a bit before lunch if anyone has to go potty to avoid the holdup of cleaning the sink again. Kids always wash after lunch as well. We always wash after art activities and we always wash everytime we come inside. It's just been a habit and kids get use to it.

[spedmommy4]

I wouldn't give it another thought. There's no way that even with a large daycare of 12 kids and 2 adults you'll be able to do everything on the lists. Somethings I refused to do anyway so I'll take the low score.

Some of my "centers" are outside so I got dinged for not having everything inside . The only way to get everything they expect me to have inside is if I get rid of my couches, entertainment center and dining room table ... leaving me with absolutely no adult size furniture downstairs. Yeah, no.

Another one for me was that my changing table isn't next to a sink. It's across the living room and bathroom because that's the only place it will fit. My downstairs bathroom is seriously like 5 x 7 and only has room for a toilet and a sink. They wanted me to move the entertainment center which is next to the bathroom and place my changing table there. That means that my TV would have to go next to my couch (on the same wall) so what then? My family can't watch TV then unless we stand in front of it since we can't see the TV if we sit down

I just told the lady that I'd be more than happy to take the low score because I wasn't interested in doing all that. No one's got time for all that ::

It sounds like we might have a similar changing area setup. I literally had no space so I did this. (See photo) I got this changing table on amazon.com for 150. It is now next to the bathroom and is a serious time saver.