Its All About The Money.... (Just My Opinion)

[Angelsj]

This is a topic that has been debated since my first time on an internet daycare board in 98.

I have seen thousands of these threads and they all are the same end game.

I know you intended to discuss parents bringing kids on their time off when they are paying a full slot but the concept of only charging for attendance is what I'm interested in.

I don't know of any provider who has charged by attendance and is a veteran provider.

Are there any providers here who have made a career of charging a daily rate by attendance only? Or an hourly rate by attendance only?

I have seen thousands try it and either go out of business or switch but I haven't heard of anyone who has made it to the five or ten year mark. Maybe if they have a spouse paying the family's way.. but if they need income they would have a terrible time. Also, having kids who are very part time sporadically would be a nightmare job.

A lot of providers start doing daycare as the daycare they would have liked to have had as a parent accessing daycare. That works for the loving stuff but not the money stuff. Once they start allowing unpaid days and rotating schedules, they go broke. Once they allow "mildly ill" kids they go broke.

I pray you aren't considering that unless it's just to make SOME money. Being new to daycare it will be tough to manage the occasional kids.

Yes, Nan, there are.
And no, I am not broke, nor do I count on my husband's income. We have often counted ONLY on mine. It can be done. It is a lot of work, and it is necessary to have respectful, long term clients. But it can and is being done.
Now you know one

[nannyde]

Yes, Nan, there are.
And no, I am not broke, nor do I count on my husband's income. We have often counted ONLY on mine. It can be done. It is a lot of work, and it is necessary to have respectful, long term clients. But it can and is being done.
Now you know one

So you have no minimum days of attendance and no paid vacation, holiday etc?

Verrrrry interesting!


What's your infant and total capacity?

[Cradle2crayons]

I'm one of a dying breed here also.

I take TWO vacation days a year.... Thanksgiving day and Christmas Day...

I work weekends... Afternoons... And nights... Not on the same day .


Nobody here provides the type of care I provide. Which is disheartening because most single moms work as a waitress and non traditional shifts.

The only reason this type of care isn't offered is because most families have support from other family members who step in and help. Generally it's grandma because I'm speaking in general around here.. The dads are POOF GONE..

I offer CONTRACTED care... Scheduled only... But still require pay regardless. I do also offer drop in care and I save my fifth spot for that and generally get that a few times a month. I also do overnight for current or past clients only and I charge substantially for that availability.

What I've found over the years is that parents don't mind paying $60 for one overnight stent... But complain for having to pay $100 for five days of care. It seems to be acceptable to pay whatever is asked for party night but not for care while they work. At least that's been my experience.

The difference is... My kids are ONLY here during working hours for x amount weekly.. If they want to play... They pay... It works for me... And apparently it works for them too.

[Angelsj]

So you have no minimum days of attendance and no paid vacation, holiday etc?

Verrrrry interesting!


What's your infant and total capacity?

Nope, none of those...though I will say, I have some pretty generous parents who often pay me on vacation days anyway.

I can have a total of 10 at any given time. I have 17 on my registry. Some days I am full, others I am not, but I can make a living on what I have.
I can have two under a year, but I only take one.

And another interesting tidbit? I also take those "mildly ill" children. And again, my parents are awesome. It is VERY rare that they do not keep their kids home when sick (why not, since it won't cost them) and I NEVER have a dope and drop. They will tell me in the morning exactly what is going on and I can and will give mild meds like tylenol or nebs if requested and paperwork is in order. I even have parents bring me the morning dose of antibiotic "because the child will only take it from you" Whatever, mom

I am incredibly selective. The kids must mesh, the parents must be reasonable, and the hours must work. They also need to understand that some of the kids in care are (quite legally) NOT immunized, and be ok with that. They understand from the beginning that me taking THEIR child who is mildly ill means I also take other children who are mildly ill, so their kid is likely to be exposed. They also understand that children spread a lot of illness before anyone knows anyone is sick, so honestly, they are exposed anyway.

I will give you that most people do not (or do not want) to operate this way, but it works and always has worked for me.

[Cat Herder]

Work smarter or work harder... your choice.

[Blackcat31]

Yes, Nan, there are.
And no, I am not broke, nor do I count on my husband's income. We have often counted ONLY on mine. It can be done. It is a lot of work, and it is necessary to have respectful, long term clients. But it can and is being done.
Now you know one

I'm one of a dying breed here also.

You both serve children/families 24 hours a day though correct?

Or at the minimum much longer days/hours of availability than other providers...

[GabsKids]

Another way I started looking at it, is this:

When a daycare teacher works in a center, she gets paid the same amount whether her classroom is full or not.

When a teacher in a school shows up to her classroom and has 2 kids that are absent, she doesn't get paid any less.

[Controlled Chaos]

This is a topic that has been debated since my first time on an internet daycare board in 98.

I have seen thousands of these threads and they all are the same end game.

I know you intended to discuss parents bringing kids on their time off when they are paying a full slot but the concept of only charging for attendance is what I'm interested in.

I don't know of any provider who has charged by attendance and is a veteran provider.

Are there any providers here who have made a career of charging a daily rate by attendance only? Or an hourly rate by attendance only?

I have seen thousands try it and either go out of business or switch but I haven't heard of anyone who has made it to the five or ten year mark. Maybe if they have a spouse paying the family's way.. but if they need income they would have a terrible time. Also, having kids ywho are very part time sporadically would be a nightmare job.

A lot of providers start doing daycare as the daycare they would have liked to have had as a parent accessing daycare. That works for the loving stuff but not the money stuff. Once they start allowing unpaid days and rotating schedules, they go broke. Once they allow "mildly ill" kids they go broke.

I pray you aren't considering that unless it's just to make SOME money. Being new to daycare it will be tough to manage the occasional kids.

Yep. I spent 2 years trying to be the daycare I wanted as a parent and burnt out bad emotionally and financially. Now I am becoming g the business owner I want to be. It is an adjustment for me and the parents but when I said it was between closing down or enforcing dozen new policies the parents completely understood. I was touched by how they had thought I was worth more than I did. Don't underestimate your worth as a childcare provider or the worth of your time.

[Controlled Chaos]

Work smarter or work harder... your choice.

haha. This

[Meyou]

I honestly think that any provider who is upset/stressed by parents bringing their children when they work probably aren't charging enough and possibly need to look at their setup and hours.

I USED to be stressed and I used to be upset by parents doing this but at this point I make a great income, work nice hours that aren't too long and I don't even know where the parents are most days. I had to tweak both my business and my mind set to make it work. I charged more, changed my payment terms, decreased my hours and upped my late fees. It was totally worth it.

[Cradle2crayons]

You both serve children/families 24 hours a day though correct?

Or at the minimum much longer days/hours of availability than other providers...

I'm AVAILABLE for any shift... but I sign up depending on what schedule they need so that I don't have kids 24/7 of course.

HOWEVER, I do work most weekends. In return for that I'm off some weekdays I get to spend at my kids school volunteering which makes me AND them very happy! And there are days here and there I have a child here at 6am that leaves at 3pm and another two that arrive at 11am and don't leave until 8pm etc if that answers the question.

but no, I'm not aware of ANY other providers that accept kids around here for non traditional shifts. I'm also the ONLY in home provider in my county that accepts state pay.

The benefit to my schedule is that when I need or want specific days off, since two of my three parents make their own schedule.... is that I get what I ask for without questions asked.

Say I want to go to the river for the weekend and my husband will be in state the first weekend of October... I simply mention that to my families... and in return... we find ourselves at the river

[CedarCreek]

Speaking as a former provider and now DC parent:

I pay for a full time slot for my 4 year old DS and an SA slot for my 10 year old. We regularly do not use 1-2 days per week because either DH or I are off of work. We keep 4 yr DS at home and then meet the bus at DC for 10yr DS. We don't need an incentive to do this, we love our boys and the days are brighter when they are home with us.

Our provider (family run center) takes paid vacation and holidays off and we have no problem paying for that. I expected that when I was a provider.

The only thing I was not entirely pleased about paying was a registration fee ($50 each) and a supply fee ($100 each) for both children. 10 yr DS is only there for an hour after school on the days that he is there. So, that kind of irked me a little.

ETA:

What is all of this "me time" that parents seem to need nowadays anyway? When I chose to become a parent, all concept of "me time" kinda went out the window. I sneak in some time to read or watch tv while my kiddos are playing in their playroom or after they go to sleep. I dont need a whole "spa day" to myself all of the time. Maybe that's just me.

[Play Care]

Yep. I spent 2 years trying to be the daycare I wanted as a parent and burnt out bad emotionally and financially. Now I am becoming g the business owner I want to be. It is an adjustment for me and the parents but when I said it was between closing down or enforcing dozen new policies the parents completely understood. I was touched by how they had thought I was worth more than I did. Don't underestimate your worth as a childcare provider or the worth of your time.

The ironic thing is that I still GIVE my clients TWO WEEKS of FREE VACATION time. All they have to do is give a month's notice. TWO WEEKS that they don't have to pay for and can spend time with their child. Most often I go YEARS without anyone using that time.

They take plenty of time off for "me" time (which I don't care about so long as I can get in touch, I'm simply pointing that out in case anyone thinks the reason they don't use the time is to cover any of my time off - they take time off for themselves all.the. time. ) I'm honestly thinking of taking the time away.

So when you DO give "free" time, they don't want to use it. Might as well get paid.

[Angelsj]

You both serve children/families 24 hours a day though correct?

Or at the minimum much longer days/hours of availability than other providers...

I am available for a variety of shifts, but I only have daytimers right now. I am available outside normal hours, if the child/family fits. I have no regular overnighters, but I have done that. I do not work weekends now, but I have in the past.

If the point is that extended hours are necessary to operating in this fashion, perhaps, but there is also the "on work" "off work" concept that a lot of providers have (and that is perfectly ok.) I don't have that. I am here. Kids coming and going in my house is something that has been perfectly natural since I was quite young. Getting paid to have some of them here...bonus!
If a child is here during a meal time, they eat. If one is here at bedtime, they sleep.
I understand that a lot of providers don't work this way or feel this way, and that is fine. I just take a little bit of exception to the idea that it CANNOT work or absolutely will cause burnout. How I operate is not a problem for me, and provides a niche of care that virtually no one around me will do. It keeps me full and gives me lots of little grandbabies to love on and then send home.
Not saying it is easy or that everyone should operate this way. Just that it is not impossible to do so long term.

[Angelsj]

Work smarter or work harder... your choice.

I am not sure what you are saying here?
I still have my slots full enough to pay my bills. I am never empty. I have excellent parents who are incredibly loyal and do everything under the sun to get my infant spot. Most kids stay with me until they age out to K or longer. I NEVER advertise. 90% of the "problems" I see here with parents, drop offs, sick kids, dope and drop, etc, I do not have...ever.
How exactly is this not working smart?