Does Anyone Have Experience With A Dck Who May Have Seizures? Questions/Rant..

[TheGoodLife]

The thing is, and I've seen it preached over and over on this forum, we don't know what the other conversation was about. It could've been very important.

I see complaints about the inadequacies of parents on the forum all the time, some of them from me. But I think this mom IS on top of it. She's still learning the ropes of what it means to have an epileptic child. She's going through some life altering changes right now and it is to be expected that she's overwhelmed. That's exactly what it sounds like to me, an overwhelmed mom.

The aspects that she doesn't have together? She'll get it together. She just needs some time to settle into this new reality. I do not believe this parent deserves a bashing because she's overwhelmed.

There was one bad phone call where mom was distracted. That deserves termination? .

The DCM chose to call the provider from a busy situation (she was at a home to possibly regime a dog) to explains VERY serious medical condition and medication for a child. NOT acceptable! That is an important issue that requires full communication and discussion- not "oh, btw, little Johnny was at the hospital for 3 days and this is what needs to be done." A Giles health care is much more important than a "rehoming visit".
An overwhelmed mom would still need to give her child's medical condition priority. The OP stated she was confused and doesn't fully understand what is needed and what is happenening with the DCK. NOT OK to leave your child in the care of someone whom you have not given the opportunity to completely understand and feel comfortable with a serious medical situation!
And finally, to keep bringing the child after requests to discuss the situation? OP has nothing from the doctor (or correct me if I'm wrong about that), is not comfortable with what needs to be done, and is not being given proper communication- that would be an immediate term for me. The liability alone would scare me.
I respect that you are comfortable with that situation, but for others that don't have the training/experience/preparation/support to work with a child who has special medical needs- there should be no push to "challenge themselves" when it comes to a child's medical situation that COULD be life-or-death in a worse case scenario! You wouldn't want a doctor to "push themselves" in something new without an experienced person overseeing them- why would you want an inexperienced, untrained daycare provider alone with your child without having proper preparation?!

[TheGoodLife]

She could hire a nanny. If I were a nanny I would do it. It isn't that I wouldn't do it but just not with other children to watch as well.

Laurel

yes, a nanny or a provider that has a small group and the experience and comfort to provide proper care would be a perfect solution.

[Laurel]

The thing is, and I've seen it preached over and over on this forum, we don't know what the other conversation was about. It could've been very important. We don't know, not even op, the extent this mom is going to. We can assume, but that doesn't make it true. I'm sure she isn't giving op a play by play of every Dr visit, every phone discussion with Dr's, every Google search she does for more info.

I see complaints about the inadequacies of parents on the forum all the time, some of them from me. But I think this mom IS on top of it. She's still learning the ropes of what it means to have an epileptic child. She's going through some life altering changes right now and it is to be expected that she's overwhelmed. That's exactly what it sounds like to me, an overwhelmed mom.

The aspects that she doesn't have together? She'll get it together. She just needs some time to settle into this new reality. I do not believe this parent deserves a bashing because she's overwhelmed. She needs some sympathy, a kind ear, a shoulder. And a chance to gather herself and her thoughts.

I am in the extreme minority on this, which is odd to me because I have extensive experience with epilepsy and can offer tons of advice. But I guess the fear of the unknown trumps that (not directed at you op). I just hate to see these people termed over something they cannot help and are in the process of figuring out.

Yes, it's a challenge. Yes, it's new and unknown territory. But how else will we grow as providers if we don't challenge ourselves? If we don't move out of our comfort zones? We can't all have a perfectly healthy, well behaved group of little angels. That's desirable of course, but it's not reality. And aren't we supposed to be in a partnership with these parents? A partnership to raise happy, healthy, smart children? I find it very disheartening that so many posters would instantly jump ship over this. The meds can be negotiated. There was one bad phone call where mom was distracted. That deserves a termination??

Everyone is saying it is for the safety of the other children, but those children would not be in any danger. There is some thrashing about that occurs with grand mals, but if you quickly move the children out of the way, there's no danger. When it's over, simply call mom for pick up. But once the child is established on meds, it isn't likely he will seize at daycare.

For the ones who said what happens when you're out for a walk or at the store, etc. What do you think mom will do in those situations? She's not going to segregate her child from society because he MIGHT have a seizure. That would be ridiculous. Life goes on. You have to roll with the punches. So yes, for me, a person who did lots of research and made sure I was educated on the type of seizures and how to handle them if/when they come, it IS no big deal.

When I took the children on walks, I'd sometimes have two riding in a double stroller and 2 walking and each holding onto the stroller on either side. It would be too hard to deal with the seizure and hope the two walkers would stay where they were supposed to stay. The seizure itself in public wouldn't bother me it would be the safety of the other children.

My child had epilepsy (the doctor's told us they call it epilepsy when no cause can be found for the seizures such as high fever or whatever). So I wouldn't have a problem watching the child if I didn't have other children. Also I'd have to be trained in what they wanted me to do.

Laurel

[Cat Herder]

My personal opinion is nobody should be pressured or guilted into doing something they do not feel qualified to do. If the worst happens and you can not defend your actions during the investigation, don't do it.

Yes, training can be sought out in case this comes up again later in your career, but for a parent (or other providers) to force it on a another adult, during the acute phase is unreasonable. They don't even know this kids full dx, yet.

This is the pdf from the best source (imho) on this issue. It is crazy long, but valuable. pg 27-32... the order is off. Numbers don't start until after page xiii. 3.2Q section A is of particular interest. "fundamentally alter the nature of the service provided" and 3.7Q section A "what is considered reasonable for a child care center that is part of a national chain may not be considered reasonable for a single provider who takes children into her home"

https://www.epilepsynorcal.org/docs/Education_DayCare.pdf

[craftymissbeth]

CatHerder,
I couldn't get your link to work, but is this it?

http://www.epilepsynorcal.org/docs/EducationandDayCare.pdf

[NightOwl]

That's the thing, mom is just as inexperienced too. This is a new ground for her too. And now she's being told she's on her own by her provider. I can't imagine being in her shoes.

If she doesn't have good service at work, then she needs to supply the provider with a land line number and shouldn't be on her phone anyway as a Preschool teacher. They just need to work out the kinks! I know the op is terming, but all of this will apply to the new provider once mom has found someone willing to care for him.

Maybe rehoming the dog is a measure she's taking because she feels like she can't care for the dog with dcbs new medical issues. She doesn't just want to dump it at the pound, she's being responsible and finding a new home. We just don't know. But everyone is assuming that she considers the dog more important. If the above statement is, true, I see rehoming the dog as putting her child first. She's relieving herself of a responsibility to better focus on dcb. But again, we just don't know for sure. Everyone just assumes.

[NightOwl]

Totally off topic, but I must say:

@ thegoodlife and laurel, and the others in this thread, I love that you guys can participate in a heated debate and not get ugly! Props to you! I love a good debate.

[craftymissbeth]

That's the thing, mom is just as inexperienced too. This is a new ground for her too. And now she's being told she's on her own by her provider. I can't imagine being in her shoes.

If she doesn't have good service at work, then she needs to supply the provider with a land line number and shouldn't be on her phone anyway as a Preschool teacher. They just need to work out the kinks! I know the op is terming, but all of this will apply to the new provider once mom has found someone willing to care for him.

Maybe rehoming the dog is a measure she's taking because she feels like she can't care for the dog with dcbs new medical issues. She doesn't just want to dump it at the pound, she's being responsible and finding a new home. We just don't know. But everyone is assuming that she considers the dog more important. If the above statement is, true, I see rehoming the dog as putting her child first. She's relieving herself of a responsibility to better focus on dcb. But again, we just don't know for sure. Everyone just assumes.

If you can't take care of a dog because of dcb's condition, then what makes you think a provider can care for multiple other children along with dcb and his condition?

[Blackcat31]

If you can't take care of a dog because of dcb's condition, then what makes you think a provider can care for multiple other children along with dcb and his condition?

....and BECAUSE mom is walking on a new path is EXACTLY why I wouldn't take her child.

If something happened on MY watch because I was not fully informed or educated, it is MY livelihood and income at risk NOT moms.

If mom truly wants to work WITH her provider then she needs to take some sort of FMLA and figure out HER child's situation BEFORE giving it to someone else to manage.

IF and WHEN a parent has their part under control, then I will make an educated decision on whether or not I'd be willing to provide care for her child.

[melilley]

That's the thing, mom is just as inexperienced too. This is a new ground for her too. And now she's being told she's on her own by her provider. I can't imagine being in her shoes.

If she doesn't have good service at work, then she needs to supply the provider with a land line number and shouldn't be on her phone anyway as a Preschool teacher. They just need to work out the kinks! I know the op is terming, but all of this will apply to the new provider once mom has found someone willing to care for him.

Maybe rehoming the dog is a measure she's taking because she feels like she can't care for the dog with dcbs new medical issues. She doesn't just want to dump it at the pound, she's being responsible and finding a new home. We just don't know. But everyone is assuming that she considers the dog more important. If the above statement is, true, I see rehoming the dog as putting her child first. She's relieving herself of a responsibility to better focus on dcb. But again, we just don't know for sure. Everyone just assumes.

They are re homing the dog, actually 3 of them- the other 2 were previously rehomed, because of either dcb's older brothers allergies or dcb's allergies. But I have a dog and dcb is here full time and older brother comes as a drop in.

[craftymissbeth]

....and BECAUSE mom is walking on a new path is EXACTLY why I wouldn't take her child.

If something happened on MY watch because I was not fully informed or educated, it is MY livelihood and income at risk NOT moms.

If mom truly wants to work WITH her provider then she needs to take some sort of FMLA and figure out HER child's situation BEFORE giving it to someone else to manage.

IF and WHEN a parent has their part under control, then I will make an educated decision on whether or not I'd be willing to provide care for her child.

Not to mention that dcd apparently has no clue either and neither of them seem like it's urgent for him to know what's going on at all.

[Cat Herder]

CatHerder,
I couldn't get your link to work, but is this it?
http://www.epilepsynorcal.org/docs/E...andDayCare.pdf

I fixed it and added the exact locations and terminology in my above post.

I do want to throw out there that child care providers are not co-parents or extended family.

There are roles, sacrifices and responsibilities that are 100% on the parents. Society keeps trying to dump more and more "parent" on care providers, but we do not have to comply.

Having children is hard and sometimes our own life goals must take a back seat to our kids needs. That is what it is to have a child, it is not mandatory, it is a privilege and a responsibility.

[melilley]

So dcm just texted me from work. She claims that dcd said that I was OK with not giving him the meds. Why in the world would I say that? She said that she gave them to me because she thought I would want them if he does start convulsing. She also said that he does have an appointment this week with the neurologist. For something so important, you would think that they would have said something. And she said sorry for all the drama. She's going to call at naptime, let's see how it goes.

[TheGoodLife]

Totally off topic, but I must say:

@ thegoodlife and laurel, and the others in this thread, I love that you guys can participate in a heated debate and not get ugly! Props to you! I love a good debate.

I'm glad you're not getting riled up here, I also love debates I think you are seeing things from the DCM's POV, which is great and I feel for the whole family, but I do disagree to the extent of credit given the mom.

That's the thing, mom is just as inexperienced too. This is a new ground for her too. And now she's being told she's on her own by her provider. I can't imagine being in her shoes.

Maybe rehoming the dog is a measure she's taking because she feels like she can't care for the dog with dcbs new medical issues. She doesn't just want to dump it at the pound, she's being responsible and finding a new home. We just don't know. But everyone is assuming that she considers the dog more important.

I agree, I feel for the mom and especially the DCK!!! It is a very scary situation to learn your child has serious medical needs! However, she CHOSE to call the provider when she didn't have the time to give her proper time for clarification and understanding. It's not like the provider called to ask questions and caught her at a bad time. Can you honestly say that, if you were in a situation that a serious medical condition caused your child to be in a hospital for 3 days, that you would not make sure to find appropriate time to contact your child's provider and give them all the information and make sure you were able to answer any questions or concerns they have? That you would not at least be able to have the time to have the conversation, even if you don't have the answers- to at least discuss everything thoroughly? I know DCM is probably not clear on everything herself, but she should make sure the provider is comfortable and be given anything/everything she needs from both her and the doctors involved. That, to me, is poor, selfish parenting- to just brush it off and take your child to a caregiver that has medical questions and concerns; whether or not she is stressed or upset, she is taking a huge risk of leaving her child without proper medical preparation/training/knowledge! And to not return a phone call after the OP has reached out to her and the DCD for help- not OK, no matter how overwhelmed you are!
She needs to make sure her provider is prepared before that first drop-off, and if not take the time to find a childcare situation that best meets all needs of her child. As a parent, nothing should ever be more important that your child's health and safety!

[SignMeUp]

I'm glad you're not getting riled up here, I also love debates I think you are seeing things from the DCM's POV, which is great and I feel for the whole family, but I do disagree to the extent of credit given the mom.



I agree, I feel for the mom and especially the DCK!!! It is a very scary situation to learn your child has serious medical needs! However, she CHOSE to call the provider when she didn't have the time to give her proper time for clarification and understanding. It's not like the provider called to ask questions and caught her at a bad time. Can you honestly say that, if you were in a situation that a serious medical condition caused your child to be in a hospital for 3 days, that you would not make sure to find appropriate time to contact your child's provider and give them all the information and make sure you were able to answer any questions or concerns they have? That you would not at least be able to have the time to have the conversation, even if you don't have the answers- to at least discuss everything thoroughly? I know DCM is probably not clear on everything herself, but she should make sure the provider is comfortable and be given anything/everything she needs from both her and the doctors involved. That, to me, is poor, selfish parenting- to just brush it off and take your child to a caregiver that has medical questions and concerns; whether or not she is stressed or upset, she is taking a huge risk of leaving her child without proper medical preparation/training/knowledge! And to not return a phone call after the OP has reached out to her and the DCD for help- not OK, no matter how overwhelmed you are!
She needs to make sure her provider is prepared before that first drop-off, and if not take the time to find a childcare situation that best meets all needs of her child. As a parent, nothing should ever be more important that your child's health and safety!

Heck, yeah I was unhappy with one of my dcms yesterday/this morning because she took her child to the e.r. in the middle of the night (night before last), where she had a shot for strep. Dcm then left the country (work-related) and instructed her parental back-up to bring child to my house this morning. Dcm left all of this info on my voicemail. I had no way to reach the back-up.
So when back-up brought child in this morning and said child had no fever since last night I said 'sorry, child can't come until she's fever-free for 24 hours'. Of course The Doctor said she could have come 24 hours after the shot

In short: My dcm did not take the time to figure out the situation for her child with strep. And child was not allowed to attend.
So, a seizure disorder (presumably on-going?) without proper information/training/guidance? There is no way I could take that child in good conscience.

Adding this here too. My child had two seizures as a toddler. Looked like imminent death. Blue face, no breathing, limbs jerking. I suspended care until we had things figured out. It was the scariest thing I have ever seen. And yes, child was at risk of death.