I'm probably the kind of DCM that you guys hate...

[FrustratedMom]

I'm sure that none of you would do this, but I need some opinions here.

I'm at the end of my rope with my son's daycare center. I have received 6 calls since the middle of June to pick him up because he's "sick." I believe that at least 3 of these were unwarranted.

The first was due to a rash. On June 14th, my son started running a fever. On the 16th I took him to the doctor and he was dx'd with a viral infection. We were told to treat him with Tylenol and if there was a rash then we know it was Roseolla. I kept him out the 16th, 17, and 18th. He probably could have gone back on the 18th since the fever subsided late on the 16th, but I kept him out an extra day anyway. Sure enough, a week later the rash shows up. The daycare admin freaks out thinking it's HFMD. I take him back to the doctor, who again dx's Roseolla, but also finds an ear infection. We start treatment on the ears and keep him out an extra day. On the following day I return to daycare with a note saying he's cleared to come back. An hour after I drop him off I get a call that they think my doctor is wrong and I need to come get him.

The second time was two weeks ago. I get a call that he's running a fever. My DH is off that day (studying for finals), so he goes to get him. When he gets there DS has no fever. He's not showing any signs of being sick. In fact, DS and DH spend the day playing at the park. Bear in mind here that the center is not allowed to administer any kind of medication, so he's not received any fever reducers to mask the fever.

The third time is five days after the previous incident. I get a call that he has a fever of 100.5. When I get there minutes later I take his temp myself and get 98.6. I'm not buying that he went from bad enough to call me to perfectly normal in the 15-20 minutes it took me to get there. Again, he received no fever reducer in this time. I refused to take him and went back to work. I did make alternate arrangements the next day because I didn't feel like fighting with them about that and I could do that without missing any more work.

I feel like with it being summer they are understaffed and need to stay under ratio. They take on a large group of school aged kids during the summer, but don't hire on enough extra help so they are always trying to shuffle teachers from one room to another. The last time there were 2 teachers and 4 kids. It was like they needed to get it down to three kids in order to send one of the teachers on a field trip with the older kids. Of course, I can't prove any of this and if this is the case then it shouldn't be an issue going forward.

I guess the point of all this is to ask whether or not I, as a parent, have any kind of ability to dispute an exclusion? Look, I get it. You guys don't want to get sick. The other kids don't need to be sick. But, I still am not convinced that my kid is even sick.

[Thriftylady]

My first question is where and how is the temp being taken? Depending where you take it, it can come up differently and in some cases you have to add a degree or whatever.

The rash, will it depends on the licensing rules what I say to that. I would have said to them "I have a doctor's note saying he is fine why are you excluding after the dr. cleared my child?".

At this point, I would sit down with the director and have the same conversation you wrote here. Personally I would work with you as much as possible as long as you are trying to follow the rules and perhaps they will also. Perhaps center staff has some miscommunication on some of the things. Ask for a meeting and go from there.

[BrooklynM]

First of all mom to mom- trust your instincts. This is your baby, you need to dig deep in your gut and ask yourself if this is the right place for your baby. How old is your baby, by the way?

Second of all- Daycare provider to mom- it sounds a bit excessive. It is hard to say since we only see your side of things and don't see the daycare providers side. How long has your baby been with the provider? I know for me and my daycare kids, I know their personalities very well and I can tell most of the time before the parents when a baby is sick. The fact that your baby had an ear infection could indicate he had fevers that were fighting off infection. Are they documenting what exactly the reasons that they are excluding him are?

His age would be helpful to know a couple of things- first off, if this is a center and not a small provider, they may not be able to give the baby attention needed when they are even "off" (there is a LOT more of this coming if your baby is young-teething, etc). If your child is 2 or so then if they are not able to participate in daily activities that could be a reason for exclusion.

I worked when my parents were babies/toddlers and it is TOUGH. You feel like your boss and co-workers think less of you when your baby is sick and it starts to interfere with your performance. Are you married or do you have anyone to help you? Hugs :hug:

[Unregistered]

My first question is where and how is the temp being taken? Depending where you take it, it can come up differently and in some cases you have to add a degree or whatever.

The rash, will it depends on the licensing rules what I say to that. I would have said to them "I have a doctor's note saying he is fine why are you excluding after the dr. cleared my child?".

At this point, I would sit down with the director and have the same conversation you wrote here. Personally I would work with you as much as possible as long as you are trying to follow the rules and perhaps they will also. Perhaps center staff has some miscommunication on some of the things. Ask for a meeting and go from there.

Thanks for taking the time to read this.

Temp was taken with a standard digital thermometer under his arm. Which he fights tooth and nail. No clue whether they added a degree or not. I used the kind that touches to the forehead (just happened to have it in my purse).

The paperwork that came home with him for the rash stated that he was being sent home for "not feeling well enough to participate in daily activities." He was giggling and banging a chair up and down on the floor when I got there. Basically they were going to send him home regardless.

[Shell]

Hmm, I usually want to give the daycare the benefit of the doubt because often times the doctor just writes a return to daycare note, and the child is miserable and has to be sent home. In this case, it sounds like there might be some kind of ratio issue going on here. You mention it might be because of school age kids, and it should end soon with kids going to school. I personally wouldn't keep my child at a place where I felt they were intentionally being dishonest. I would meet with the director, and mention all this like PP said. I would be weary though even if they stop with the calls- sometimes these calls are warranted, but if you disagree, definitely meet with the director!

[FrusteratedMom]

First of all mom to mom- trust your instincts. This is your baby, you need to dig deep in your gut and ask yourself if this is the right place for your baby. How old is your baby, by the way?

Second of all- Daycare provider to mom- it sounds a bit excessive. It is hard to say since we only see your side of things and don't see the daycare providers side. How long has your baby been with the provider? I know for me and my daycare kids, I know their personalities very well and I can tell most of the time before the parents when a baby is sick. The fact that your baby had an ear infection could indicate he had fevers that were fighting off infection. Are they documenting what exactly the reasons that they are excluding him are?

His age would be helpful to know a couple of things- first off, if this is a center and not a small provider, they may not be able to give the baby attention needed when they are even "off" (there is a LOT more of this coming if your baby is young-teething, etc). If your child is 2 or so then if they are not able to participate in daily activities that could be a reason for exclusion.

I worked when my parents were babies/toddlers and it is TOUGH. You feel like your boss and co-workers think less of you when your baby is sick and it starts to interfere with your performance. Are you married or do you have anyone to help you? Hugs :hug:

He's 13 months. He's still in the infant room as they don't move up until 18 months. It's the center that is associated with my job and the only one that has slots open that's not church-based. No offense to those of you with religious beliefs, but I want curriculum not indoctrination.

I'm supposed to get written documents every time he's sent home. They usually just use the "not able to participate in daily activities" checkbox and/or the "fever" checkbox. I have no problems picking him up if he's really sick and have done so 2 or three times in between the first incident and the second incident listed. However, there are times that I just don't believe he's actually sick.

I am married, but my husband is in nursing school, so his schedule is often less flexible than mine. I also work 0600-1530 so that also limits my options.

[EntropyControlSpecialist]

I'm sure that none of you would do this, but I need some opinions here.

I'm at the end of my rope with my son's daycare center. I have received 6 calls since the middle of June to pick him up because he's "sick." I believe that at least 3 of these were unwarranted.

The first was due to a rash. On June 14th, my son started running a fever. On the 16th I took him to the doctor and he was dx'd with a viral infection. We were told to treat him with Tylenol and if there was a rash then we know it was Roseolla. I kept him out the 16th, 17, and 18th. He probably could have gone back on the 18th since the fever subsided late on the 16th, but I kept him out an extra day anyway. Sure enough, a week later the rash shows up. The daycare admin freaks out thinking it's HFMD. I take him back to the doctor, who again dx's Roseolla, but also finds an ear infection. We start treatment on the ears and keep him out an extra day. On the following day I return to daycare with a note saying he's cleared to come back. An hour after I drop him off I get a call that they think my doctor is wrong and I need to come get him.
What does your center's illness policy state? That is the most importang thing for this part.
I, personally, exclude for rashes until they are cleared up. Every single time I have tried to make an exception for this because the parent/Doctor stated that it was not contagious it ended up being contagious and everyone got it. Really heartbreaking when a group of 9 other children come down with this "non-contagious" rash and the other parents are out $$$ taking them to the Doctor and missing work. Does that make sense? So, again, just check on your center's policy. If it doesn't mention rash then I would sit down with the Director and ask what their policy is regarding Doctor's notes. If a Doctor clears your child and their child is not displaying a symptom in their illness policy then can they come back? Ultimately, possibly unfortunately for you, it is always the center or home's choice to readmit a child they believe to be sick.

The second time was two weeks ago. I get a call that he's running a fever. My DH is off that day (studying for finals), so he goes to get him. When he gets there DS has no fever. He's not showing any signs of being sick. In fact, DS and DH spend the day playing at the park. Bear in mind here that the center is not allowed to administer any kind of medication, so he's not received any fever reducers to mask the fever.
That is odd and makes me think they possibly sent him home so they wouldn't be out of ratio?! I would begin asking them to take his temperature in front of you when you pick up to verify.

The third time is five days after the previous incident. I get a call that he has a fever of 100.5. When I get there minutes later I take his temp myself and get 98.6. I'm not buying that he went from bad enough to call me to perfectly normal in the 15-20 minutes it took me to get there. Again, he received no fever reducer in this time. I refused to take him and went back to work. I did make alternate arrangements the next day because I didn't feel like fighting with them about that and I could do that without missing any more work.

I feel like with it being summer they are understaffed and need to stay under ratio. BINGO!!! They take on a large group of school aged kids during the summer, but don't hire on enough extra help so they are always trying to shuffle teachers from one room to another. The last time there were 2 teachers and 4 kids. It was like they needed to get it down to three kids in order to send one of the teachers on a field trip with the older kids. Of course, I can't prove any of this and if this is the case then it shouldn't be an issue going forward.

I guess the point of all this is to ask whether or not I, as a parent, have any kind of ability to dispute an exclusion? Look, I get it. You guys don't want to get sick. The other kids don't need to be sick. But, I still am not convinced that my kid is even sick.

Is there any other place for your child to be near you that provides quality care and abides by state regulations WITHOUT sending kids home to maintain their ratios?

[FrusteratedMom]

Is there any other place for your child to be near you that provides quality care and abides by state regulations WITHOUT sending kids home to maintain their ratios?

I hate to say it, but other than this issue they really the best option based on a lot of other factors including my/DH's schedule. They are NAEYC (spelling?) accredited and Army affiliated. I love his teachers. They actually DO things with him other than watch him play all day. They do art and sing songs and even continue some of the sign language that we use at home. It's the administration that I'm actually having the problems with. The only other thing I could complain about is that they can't use my cloth diapers, but I also understand that is something that's out of their hands (Army reg) and that a lot of people are turned off by cloth.

[FrusteratedMom]

Is there any other place for your child to be near you that provides quality care and abides by state regulations WITHOUT sending kids home to maintain their ratios?

And to answer your question about the rash, it is not specifically stated that it must be cleared up, only that a doctor has ruled it non-contagious. I will say that the doctor's note could have been a little clearer on this rather than just a standard "Little Dude is cleared to return to school/daycare on X date." I offered to have something more specific faxed over but it wouldn't have mattered.

[SignMeUp]

We are encouraged to refuse children with an undiagnosed rash. Often parents think that means the doctor decides when the child returns, but this does not always conform to our business policies, which are often based on licensing requirements.
Taking temperatures with different thermometers often produces different results, especially with different types of thermometers. And for some, the temp has to be adjusted to equal an oral temp.

Those are two areas that you might want to discuss with your center's director, or that might give you a bit more information to go on. Sometimes parents don't understand the regulations that we are required to work under, and if you have more understanding, it might help you, especially since it sounds like you are happy with most aspects of your child's care.

[nannyde]

And to answer your question about the rash, it is not specifically stated that it must be cleared up, only that a doctor has ruled it non-contagious. I will say that the doctor's note could have been a little clearer on this rather than just a standard "Little Dude is cleared to return to school/daycare on X date." I offered to have something more specific faxed over but it wouldn't have mattered.

I don't allow Dr's notes to allow readmittance to daycare. They don't have the authority to do that. They think they do and the parents want them to but their opinion doesn't matter.

I would pull the child. Something is going on.

What do you mean about wanting education for your baby? Are they having conflict with you about that?

[Cat Herder]

When they were calling you for fever was your child crying inconsolably for a prolonged period of time in each case?

[KidGrind]

I hate to say it, but other than this issue they really the best option based on a lot of other factors including my/DH's schedule. They are NAEYC (spelling?) accredited and Army affiliated. I love his teachers. They actually DO things with him other than watch him play all day. They do art and sing songs and even continue some of the sign language that we use at home. It's the administration that I'm actually having the problems with. The only other thing I could complain about is that they can't use my cloth diapers, but I also understand that is something that's out of their hands (Army reg) and that a lot of people are turned off by cloth.

Well based on Army regulations if they take your child’s temperature and it’s hit the target, they have to call you for pick-up. Also, under the same regulations you have an hour to pick-up. Also, they must send home for rashes and a reoccurrence.

I have a former Army CDC client switch to my services because they called her 30 minutes after drop off claiming the 7 month old baby refused to allow them to change her diaper. She suspected it was a ratio issue + her baby being high maintenance. Also, she didn’t like her child in the summer heat sitting in the Bye Bye Buggy doing nothing. You could be onto something.

I know it may or may not be an issue because Army facilities are subsidized care for you. If it’s not an issue you may want to looking into a different facility for your son. If you are in the DMV area, prices are double or triple what you’re paying now for civilian centers. You may want to look into Army FCC Providers if they are available. Filling out an ICE complaint is your best bet.

Good luck!

[FrusteratedMom]

When they were calling you for fever was your child crying inconsolably for a prolonged period of time in each case?

Nope. He was in fantastic moods each time.

[nannyde]

Nope. He was in fantastic moods each time.

Ask them to videotape his temperature taking ... show thermometer the entire time then show the end temp. They surely have cell phones.