Childhood is Changing and I Don't Like It

[Laurel]

I think a lot of school aged kids go to programs where they have a few field trips that really are more time loading and unloading the vehicle, driving to the place, eating a pack lunch there, and coming back. I think the time they actually are at the place they go to and are.doing the actual activity is VERY small compared to the getting there and back and the meal.

It looks like they are doing stuff but because of the way the kids act it doesn't last very long.

When my son was in the Des Moines public schools program he would come home complaining that the time at the zoo, pool, park was really short. My staff assistant started going to the pool and sure enough it was ten actual minutes in the pool. She went to the lake (45 min drive) and the kids ate lunch... played ten minutes on the equipment and then back on the bus. Same routine at the zoo.

The kids spent HOURS in the gym on their rear ends playing screens. Nintendo's were common then.

I would bet that most school aged programs that are full days are spent mostly with the kids on screens. If they have them outside they fight and want back in. If they don't make it easy for the adults the adults quit.

I agree. When my son had my grandson at one of those a few years back that is the way it seemed to be. My son couldn't even pick him up early as the activity bus didn't get back until 4. They did this five days a week. A provider friend (who used to own a daycare center) said they do that for the money during the summer. If the SA kids are not physically there during the day then they don't count them in the numbers for inspection purposes. That could be true, not sure. That increases their capacity.

Laurel

[Laurel]

IDK, I spent my childhood summers (1970s) at home daycares. In those days, after breakfast, the daycare provider would shoo the school-aged kids outside with instructions not to come back until lunch time. We ran around the neighbourhood like feral children, drinking from outdoor water taps, peeing in bushes, and generally doing what we wanted. After lunch was the same thing, though we'd be fetched back to the daycare home about an hour before parents started showing up.

When my DS was a kid, until he was old enough to stay home alone, I (working mom) would enroll him in day camp type childcare for the summer. At least he go to drink from a cup or fountain, LOL.

I have to say, though, that there was minimal screen time at these camps. Maybe a movie on a really miserable, rainy day, but otherwise they were active and outdoors a lot.

When I was a kid we played outside all day. We drank out of hoses. We didn't pee in bushes though, . We were allowed in (sometimes) but we wanted to be outside. More fun. Also we didn't have central air in our houses back then so there wasn't the temptation to go in where it was 'cool' cause it wasn't cool unless we sat in front of the box fan. ::

Laurel

[Laurel]

So many kids are over-booked these days.

Here's a conversation I overheard the other day.

Father #1 - Oh, I forgot to call the little bus and tell them not to pick my dd up from school today. (The "little bus" is the afterschool Chinese program)
Father #2 - She goes every day?
F#1 - Yes, from right after school until 6.
F#2 - Who is going to watch her for the summer?
F#1 - Oh, my wife works nights so she's home until I have to leave for work. Dd will stay home with her for the summer.

Ok, Mom is home, but child is at school from 8:10 until 2:40 when she goes to the afterschool Chinese program until 6? These kids also go to Chinese school on Saturdays.

Conversation my dd had with a co-worker a month ago.

Co-worker (Korean) - I don't know what to do, my ds is doing so poorly in school. He's getting all C's and D's.
DD - What are you doing about it?
Cw - He goes to afterschool tutoring everyday until 6:00, then he has Chinese school on Saturday and Sunday for 7 1/2 hrs each day.
Dd - How do you spend time with him? Is he in any sports?
Cw - We eat dinner together. And we go places when he's off of school for Spring and Christmas. No time for sports.
Dd - Children can only control a couple of things. 1 is their eating and 2 is homework/schoolwork. Your son is overloaded with schoolwork and is trying to tell you.
Cw - You think so? Why didn't he tell me?
Dd - When was he supposed to tell you?

This 8 yo child went to school 7 hours a day, tutoring another 3 hours a day, plus Chinese school on the weekends. That's a total of 64 hours of school a week. He not only had homework from school, but from his tutoring class and his Chinese class.

After talking to my dd, the mom stopped the tutoring and Chinese classes and put the boy in the afterschool program at the school. She told my dd that was the best decision she ever made, he's whole demeanor changed. He was able to keep up with his school work and his grades started improving.

Wow, you'd think people would figure these things out but at least when someone told them they changed. That's a plus.

Laurel

[Rockgirl]

The kids are so micro-managed in every area of their lives that they can't just GO PLAY. When I was little, I went to a small home daycare. We played outside in the front yard every day, and never gave a second thought as to where the provider was, or what she was doing (she was inside). My current dckids obsess over every little move I make. They follow me around the yard, and hover around me if I sit down. Drives me nuts, plus they're missing out!

[Laurel]

The kids are so micro-managed in every area of their lives that they can't just GO PLAY. When I was little, I went to a small home daycare. We played outside in the front yard every day, and never gave a second thought as to where the provider was, or what she was doing (she was inside). My current dckids obsess over every little move I make. They follow me around the yard, and hover around me if I sit down. Drives me nuts, plus they're missing out!

So true.

Plus they seem to need a lot of equipment. Must be the toy companies, etc. pushing all their junk. I remember in elementary school we didn't have climbers, swings, etc. We had a huge blacktopped parking lot. We could use balls, jump ropes and that was about it. My friends and I played make believe like 'house', etc. Sometimes played kickball and jump rope or brought our jacks from home. Or we played tag or freeze tag or four square with the balls. We didn't need climbers, slides, etc. Those were available at parks or homes.

Laurel

P.S. Oh and the boys played "Get a worm on a stick and scare the girls game." I complained to my dad and he taught me to be able to hold a worm so when the boys taunted I just picked up the worm (although I hated it) to get them to leave me alone. It worked. :: Oh yes and we spent endless hours playing cheerleading and making up cheers.

[EntropyControlSpecialist]

The kids are so micro-managed in every area of their lives that they can't just GO PLAY. When I was little, I went to a small home daycare. We played outside in the front yard every day, and never gave a second thought as to where the provider was, or what she was doing (she was inside). My current dckids obsess over every little move I make. They follow me around the yard, and hover around me if I sit down. Drives me nuts, plus they're missing out!

LOL many of mine do, too. I feel like I am being micromanaged by a few of them as they try and figure out what I am doing, what I will be doing next, etc. RELAX KIDS! PLAY TIME IS MORE FUN THAN FOLLOWING ME!

[debbiedoeszip]

When I was a kid we played outside all day. We drank out of hoses. We didn't pee in bushes though, . We were allowed in (sometimes) but we wanted to be outside. More fun. Also we didn't have central air in our houses back then so there wasn't the temptation to go in where it was 'cool' cause it wasn't cool unless we sat in front of the box fan. ::

Laurel

We had to practically beg to be allowed inside to use the toilet. Our house had a basement that was blessedly cool during the summer, but I spent most days outside anyway (like yourself).

[cheerfuldom]

Interesting topic.

When I was little, we are on the extreme end. A large household of children left unsupervised most of the time (no joke) but I do remember spending a lot of time climbing trees, reading and making forts with blankets and rope. I know we got into trouble and would gladly have joined organized activities but on the positive, we had friends that roamed too.....riding bikes, walking to the gas station and stuff. I dont remember watching a lot of TV but we also had no cable or anything nice.

In my area, there is A LOT of choices for summer camps and activities so that is cool, plus summer school for a month where the program does a lot of play (three times the recess!) and other hands on activities so I like that. I find a lot of parents do not want their schoolagers "wasting" the summer at home daycares. They dont want to pay a lot for care but certainly want the provider to "earn" the money, not be paid to let the kids roam. That is why the camps do a lot of bus time and whatnot.....they dont charge a lot and the adult-child ratio is worse than the public school classrooms. I think the max is 40 kids to 1 adult. so you have to make it functional with that ratio. One adult is basically keeping the kids alive and from getting kidnapped but there is no interaction and only the minimum of supervision but again, the parents are not paying a lot so most of them understand this. Picky or rich parents can pay for camps that emphasize music, sports or whatever. I almost never see kids riding bikes in my neighborhood. I actually would never let me kids at any age do this alone. The world is not a place where you can let a school ager do anything by themselves and I am one of those parents that will never drop kids off anywhere, even junior high kids. a lot of people are like that too. Its not just about parenting getting worse, it is about our world changing and parents not able to give their kids freedom even if the parents would prefer their kids have the freedom.

so yeah, there are parents that are lazy, cheap, or dont understand the benefit of unstructured time BUT a lot of parents are just doing the best they can with the choices they have in today's world

[Shell]

Interesting topic.

When I was little, we are on the extreme end. A large household of children left unsupervised most of the time (no joke) but I do remember spending a lot of time climbing trees, reading and making forts with blankets and rope. I know we got into trouble and would gladly have joined organized activities but on the positive, we had friends that roamed too.....riding bikes, walking to the gas station and stuff. I dont remember watching a lot of TV but we also had no cable or anything nice.

In my area, there is A LOT of choices for summer camps and activities so that is cool, plus summer school for a month where the program does a lot of play (three times the recess!) and other hands on activities so I like that. I find a lot of parents do not want their schoolagers "wasting" the summer at home daycares. They dont want to pay a lot for care but certainly want the provider to "earn" the money, not be paid to let the kids roam. That is why the camps do a lot of bus time and whatnot.....they dont charge a lot and the adult-child ratio is worse than the public school classrooms. I think the max is 40 kids to 1 adult. so you have to make it functional with that ratio. One adult is basically keeping the kids alive and from getting kidnapped but there is no interaction and only the minimum of supervision but again, the parents are not paying a lot so most of them understand this. Picky or rich parents can pay for camps that emphasize music, sports or whatever. I almost never see kids riding bikes in my neighborhood. I actually would never let me kids at any age do this alone. The world is not a place where you can let a school ager do anything by themselves and I am one of those parents that will never drop kids off anywhere, even junior high kids. a lot of people are like that too. Its not just about parenting getting worse, it is about our world changing and parents not able to give their kids freedom even if the parents would prefer their kids have the freedom.

so yeah, there are parents that are lazy, cheap, or dont understand the benefit of unstructured time BUT a lot of parents are just doing the best they can with the choices they have in today's world

Kids in my neighborhood don't know how to ride a bike because they are in daycare all day long, and parents are too busy racing around on the weekend to teach them! It's kind of entertaining watching some elementary school aged kids racing around with training wheels ::

[Laurel]

Kids in my neighborhood don't know how to ride a bike because they are in daycare all day long, and parents are too busy racing around on the weekend to teach them! It's kind of entertaining watching some elementary school aged kids racing around with training wheels ::

There aren't a lot of bike riders in our neighborhood or even kids because they are all at summer 'camp'!

Laurel

[Laurel]

Interesting topic.

When I was little, we are on the extreme end. A large household of children left unsupervised most of the time (no joke) but I do remember spending a lot of time climbing trees, reading and making forts with blankets and rope. I know we got into trouble and would gladly have joined organized activities but on the positive, we had friends that roamed too.....riding bikes, walking to the gas station and stuff. I dont remember watching a lot of TV but we also had no cable or anything nice.

In my area, there is A LOT of choices for summer camps and activities so that is cool, plus summer school for a month where the program does a lot of play (three times the recess!) and other hands on activities so I like that. I find a lot of parents do not want their schoolagers "wasting" the summer at home daycares. They dont want to pay a lot for care but certainly want the provider to "earn" the money, not be paid to let the kids roam. That is why the camps do a lot of bus time and whatnot.....they dont charge a lot and the adult-child ratio is worse than the public school classrooms. I think the max is 40 kids to 1 adult. so you have to make it functional with that ratio. One adult is basically keeping the kids alive and from getting kidnapped but there is no interaction and only the minimum of supervision but again, the parents are not paying a lot so most of them understand this. Picky or rich parents can pay for camps that emphasize music, sports or whatever. I almost never see kids riding bikes in my neighborhood. I actually would never let me kids at any age do this alone. The world is not a place where you can let a school ager do anything by themselves and I am one of those parents that will never drop kids off anywhere, even junior high kids. a lot of people are like that too. Its not just about parenting getting worse, it is about our world changing and parents not able to give their kids freedom even if the parents would prefer their kids have the freedom.

so yeah, there are parents that are lazy, cheap, or dont understand the benefit of unstructured time BUT a lot of parents are just doing the best they can with the choices they have in today's world

That is true too. When I was a child most moms did not work outside the home. A few did but not the majority. BIG difference.

Laurel

[Play Care]

I see both sides. I did have a SAHM, so no dc/babysitter. While I have some fond memories I also remember a lot of boredom and getting into trouble (due to the lack of supervision). We heard "GO PLAY" a lot

I try to find a balance for my own kids - so they are signed up for camps, clinics and lessons - but not all day "day care" types. Because I have a sub covering my dc, I usually stay to watch - so I know *exactly* what they are doing and what type of program it is. I also want to make sure they are getting a lot of "downtime" to relax, ride bikes/scooters, swim, have friends over, etc.

I dunno, maybe I was just "precocious" :: but I do NOT want my kids doing some of the things I did while spending most of my days unsupervised.

[Laurel]

I see both sides. I did have a SAHM, so no dc/babysitter. While I have some fond memories I also remember a lot of boredom and getting into trouble (due to the lack of supervision). We heard "GO PLAY" a lot

I try to find a balance for my own kids - so they are signed up for camps, clinics and lessons - but not all day "day care" types. Because I have a sub covering my dc, I usually stay to watch - so I know *exactly* what they are doing and what type of program it is. I also want to make sure they are getting a lot of "downtime" to relax, ride bikes/scooters, swim, have friends over, etc.

I dunno, maybe I was just "precocious" :: but I do NOT want my kids doing some of the things I did while spending most of my days unsupervised.

We were supervised when I was a child for the most part. Plus, most moms were home so we'd go from one house to the next. Some mom was always looking out the window. It was truly the village kind of thing. We were allowed to go some places alone as long as we asked mom. We used to walk to the neighborhood pool as preteens and go to the library on our bikes and play in the woods behind our house. Plus we had a finished basement and we were allowed to play down there until my mom got tired of the noise and then she'd tell us to go outside. We had the house everyone wanted to hang out at. My dad was a do it yourself guy and he put up a big blackboard with a ledge on it for chalk and we played school. He was an electrician and he hooked up our turntable to a microphone and we had our own karaoke (sp?). But sometimes my mom would need some peace and quiet and would say that "We couldn't go out that day and no one could come in." She'd also say "Everybody can't run in here and go potty all day. Everybody goes at their own house."

But now all the neighbor kids seem to be at daycare all day. Both parents work. I wish we did have some classes that weren't in the evening. I am still going to check around. We have a bowling alley near us maybe my 14 year old grandson could get on a teen league. We did that when I was young. Maybe Home Depot or Lowe's has some kind of program. I know they do for little kids. They go and make something with wood.

Laurel

[WImom]

I guess we are lucky here. Our school district has "field houses" at the schools where there are college workers and they do activities and games with the kids every day. (Arts and crafts, baseball, old school games like tag, kick ball, etc). Kids come and go during the day, there is no sign in - lots of kids ride their bikes up there. They also have many camps too in our city. My daughters will go to the field house when they want and then I signed them both up for one week of Girl Scout Camp and one of my daughters in a 1/2 day 1 week soccer camp to work on skills.

We have an awesome rec dept. here though. So many activities.

[SignMeUp]

Some of the churches near me have day camps. Inexpensive, plus anyone who needs a scholarship can get one. They do all kinds of fun things, depending on age: swimming, wave pools, barbeques, crafts, put on plays, ride horses, etc.
Their lunches are really cheapo though :: and would never meet food program standards. Koolaid and p.b. sandwich, stuff like that. But the kids don't seem to complain ::