Gay Marriage

[bluemoose_mom]

What verse are you referring to when God condones a polygamy marriage?

I quoted this verse over the Genesis one because it talks about divorce and remarrying (which was talked about earlier).

As a believer, I choose to believe that the message has been preserved by God. People can misinterpret the scriptures, sure but that doesn't mean that the original message isn't there or that we're not talking about the original message right now.

However, I *believe* that and am not offended by people who don't as long as they don't shove it down my throat (not saying you particularly) just like I don't shove it down other people's throat. I only brought scripture into this discussion because someone asked. I do believe that scripture should not be brought into a discussion like this because people who don't believe, it means nothing. I might as well be reading from the phone book--which is fine.

I am torn over this being a separation between church and state. My husband (who is a believer as well) thinks Gay marriage should be allowed (as determined by the states, not federal), with no distinction between hetro or gay. I don't have much wrong with this thought...because I am torn (other than I think it needs to be defined by federal, to cause less confusion.

[Candy]

Not sure who asked to many post. But no the church was not always involved in marriage. I don't exactly remember why or what happened(i have been out of highschool to long) but the catholic church started to get involved in marriages in england. Im guessing it was like the 1400's or something. So marriage was not always a religious thing.

[momofboys]

I personally don't care what other people do.

However with that said, I do think marriage should be between a man and a woman.

That doesn't mean though that I don't think gay and lesbian couples shouldn't be allowed to have civil unions or be lawfully joined so they too can receive the benefits and perks that married folks do.

I just don't agree with the term "marriage" and although others may feel that is wrong or not socially acceptable, I don't care. It is what I believe and that isn't going to change.

I have no issues with gay/lesbian couples who want to raise children and do all the same things other couples do. I am not one bit prejudice or biased against anyone who wants to be in a committed relationship with the person they love. Whether that person is the same sex as them or not.

ITA with^

[jen]

In the Bible, we read “Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel.” (1 Peter 2:18).

Now, none of us (at least I hope) think it is OK to have slaves. We have grown as a society and have been able to set aside passages in the Bible when they were in conflict with today's values and understanding of right and wrong. If this were not true, women would not be allowed speak in church, people would still have slaves, and women would have to hide in a cave for 7 days after giving birth, etc.

So, herein lies my confusion. I have never heard anyone say that they are going to go get themselves a slave because the Bible said its OK. Yet, everyday we hear people express the belief that others should be denied their constitutional rights (pursuit of life, liberty, and freedom) based on a Bible verse.

#stillnotgettingit

[CedarCreek]

^^word.

[jokalima]

uh...so you don't think that single parents should be allowed children either? They don't have both figures.

I said deliberately , a single parent that had no choice or voice is another story, but for someone to choose if a child will or will not have a mom/dad, for me that is not fair.

[Lucy]

For others who choose to "marry" outside the sanctuary of a church without the religious meaning....then yes, if you want to get technical, I personally would consider that a civil union or legal commitment.

My husband and I got hitched at the City Council office by a county judge. Are we married?

[nannyde]

I said deliberately , a single parent that had no choice or voice is another story, but for someone to choose if a child will or will not have a mom/dad, for me that is not fair.

I'm a single adaptive mom. My son is 12 and his birth parents chose me over potential adoptive parents who were married.

He's a great kid and is well behaved. He's sweet and fair. He's a good friend. He's also doing very very well in school.

The vast majority of kids he hangs out with are being raised by single parents.

We need to stop the mindset that it's some sort of disability to be a single parent or be the child of a single parent. It's very common now and is a HUGE part of the scheme of today's modern family. We need to stop the deferential treatment of single parenting as well as the prejudice.

The mindset you speak of is exactly what many single parents are banking on to get a whole lot of special. If you are tired of paying for it then consider what unintended consequences come from your pity.

[Lyss]

We need to stop the mindset that it's some sort of disability to be a single parent or be the child of a single parent. It's very common now and is a HUGE part of the scheme of today's modern family. We need to stop the deferential treatment of single parenting as well as the prejudice.

The mindset you speak of is exactly what many single parents are banking on to get a whole lot of special. If you are tired of paying for it then consider what unintended consequences come from your pity.

With a divorce rate like we have (in the US anyway, I'm not sure what other countries are like) I think we really need to learn to move on from the single parent stigma

[Candy]

I said deliberately , a single parent that had no choice or voice is another story, but for someone to choose if a child will or will not have a mom/dad, for me that is not fair.

Not understanding what you are saying. How is that not fair?

[CedarCreek]

I said deliberately , a single parent that had no choice or voice is another story, but for someone to choose if a child will or will not have a mom/dad, for me that is not fair.

That's assuming that you know every single parents story. And you don't. Obviously you did not intend to insult single parents but I would hope that you can see the similarity in having one mother or father figure in either situation and how you cannot have any idea if raising a child in that way could be detrimental. I can only assume that is what you mean by "unfair".

I respect that you have an opinion but I do not understand it.

[Michelle]

OK I will jump in
first I totally agree with Black cat.
Also speaking from a child's emotional well being...
( mainly a gay couple's child)

Little Johnny is in school and the teacher says:
"O.K. kids now everyone needs to take this permission slip home and have your mom or dad sign it for the field trip tomorrow"

Suzy says.." Johnny doesn't have a mommy... he has 2 daddy's"

Everyone: "ewwwwww! "
Johnny goes home crying and parents call Gloria Allred and sues the school, parents, and state for child's mental distress..
( I know I am exaggerating but I think that's where we are headed)

[MNMommy2]

My sister is a lesbian who has had a partner for 11 years and has been afraid to tell anyone. I finally found out 2 years ago, my other siblings a year ago. My parents still don't know. It breaks my heart. It is not fair--they want to be a family and have every right to.

It makes my heart so happy to hear so many people supporting gay marriage. I honestly don't see how it affects anybody but those involved.

And, oh my, why shouldn't gay couples have kids/adopt. I have seen plenty of s#!&&y parents who are mom/dad and how do those kids fare? My sister and her girlfriend are wonderful people who deserve a family.

[julie]

I am a Christian, and I wholeheartedly believe gay people should be allowed to marry if they choose.

First of all, I don't think being gay is a choice. I think you are born that way. I don't understand how anyone could think that it would be a "choice" to be persecuted in the way that gays are. I have also had several friends that were Christian and gay and hated themselves so much because people told them it was a choice to be gay. But they were born that way, and couldn't change it if they tried. It is a part of themselves from birth, like a skin color, like a gender. And therefore, I believe God created gays in His infinite wisdom. And to Him, they are perfect, though not without sin, and created in His image just like any one of us.

If we are going for scripture, here's one that I base MY faith on:
Matthew 22:36-40

New International Version (NIV)

36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[b] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

The Bible, while a very important and meaningful work, is also largely a social and historical commentary on the time it was written, in my opinion. In the time it was written, polygamy was not looked down upon, owning slaves was common, etc. Now men CAN touch the skin of a pig with their bare hands and do so at every football game. The verses and ideas evolve. That's how we get from a theme of "eye for an eye" in the Old Testament to "The golden rule" in the New Testament. We are still evolving. The times are still changing.

The verse above means something to me because it transcends time. I can make it applicable to almost every circumstance and my conscience will tell me the right path. Here, I'll do it for you now. It is easy for me to love the Lord with all my soul and heart and mind. This includes for me everything that He has made, which would therefore include gay people. Second, I will love my neighbor as myself. If my neighbor was a gay person, I would still want them to have everything in life that I have been blessed with. That would include a loving MARRIAGE, children, pets, a home, a full and fantastic life. I would not tell them they could have all of those things, as long as they named their union something lesser than my own. That is condescending. I would not want someone to be condescending to me, so I will not love my neighbor by treating him this way. Therefore, if I want marriage for myself, I want marriage for my neighbor, including if my neighbor is gay. This is how I interpret the scripture.

In my opinion, anyone willing to make the choice to make vows with their spouse and a commitment for life deserves the right to be married and call it marriage.

[CedarCreek]

OK I will jump in
first I totally agree with Black cat.
Also speaking from a child's emotional well being...
( mainly a gay couple's child)

Little Johnny is in school and the teacher says:
"O.K. kids now everyone needs to take this permission slip home and have your mom or dad sign it for the field trip tomorrow"

Suzy says.." Johnny doesn't have a mommy... he has 2 daddy's"

Everyone: "ewwwwww! "
Johnny goes home crying and parents call Gloria Allred and sues the school, parents, and state for child's mental distress..
( I know I am exaggerating but I think that's where we are headed)

1. That shouldn't even be an issue for children to say "ew" about.

2. What you're talking about is bullying and I hear it's not tolerated in schools nowadays.

Every kid has to deal with being picked on for something in their life. Can you think of nothing that your own children will be bullied for? I would assume that you would be upset too over it.