Help With Older Baby Nap (Gentle Suggestions Please)

[juniper]

Hi,

I am a new home daycare provider, just opened a month ago. So far its been great, btw. I have a 9 month old dcg who has been with me since the beginning and is having a rough time with naps. She is small and had been swaddled here (at her parents' request) until she rolled over in the swaddle and I said no more swaddle. At first it was just this girl and my own son (age 2), and over the course of a couple weeks, I was able to gently transition her to falling asleep with me in the room singing but not rubbing her belly or sitting next to her. This was while she was swaddled. Since stopping the swaddle, she has had a very rough time falling asleep, it can take an hour (and my timing is not off, she is clearly tired), and cries hysterically if I am not rubbing her belly. Now that I have additional kids starting on the days she comes (3 days a week), I really can't spend an hour putting her to sleep. It's not fair to the other kids. Also, she currently only sleeps 20 minutes at a time - this was both in and out of the swaddle.

So I would love some gentle ideas both for helping her fall asleep and getting herself back to sleep when she wakes after 20 minutes. I currently use white noise and can stay in the room with her until she falls asleep but need to be by the door so I can see the other kids too. She will not nap in a carrier or in the room with other kids playing. Her parents are not into cry it out (and neither am I).

Part of the issue, though, is that at least when dad puts her to bed he holds her until she falls asleep. Mom stands by her side while she sleeps to help her get back to sleep 20 minutes in. Neither of these are things I can do here and still meet the needs of the other kids.

Sorry so long and thanks in advance for any ideas.

[juniper]

One other thing to add - at home she sleeps in a sleepsack with the armholes seen shut (so her arms are inside - like a loose swaddle). I can't use that here. I think it may be part of the problem as well. Her parents say she can't sleep at home with her hands free though I don't think that is what's keeping her awake here.

[Heidi]

Yeah...I don't know what to tell you because I think it may be time for some tough love. She is associating falling asleep with having you there, and if you're not there when she rouses 20 minutes in, she's awake and freaking out. She needs more sleep and she needs to fall asleep without you there.

The only thing I can suggest is the method of going in periodically, laying her back down, rubbing belly, then walking away. Rinse and repeat but I would not stay in there. You can whisper soothingly, you touch her gently, but each time in should be a little longer apart.

As for the swaddle, consider a sleep sack. It won't hold her arms down, but it may make her feel more secure. Or, tuck her blanket down around the mattress bottom and sides to semi-swaddle her.

By 9 months, most babies roll onto their tummies, stick their tushies up, and go to sleep, even those who've always slept on their backs.

If she wakes after 20 minutes, wait a few minutes to see if she settles (3-5 minutes). If not, go in, lay her down, whisper "it's still nap time, sweety".. keep doing this until she's slept at least an hour or so at a crack. Usually at 9 months, they are taking 2 2-hour naps, or and hour in the am and 3 in the pm.

[Heidi]

I just saw that about the sleep sack.

In WI, we are allowed to swaddle, but the prefered method is to lay them on their backs, then with a thin blanket, pretty much pin them to the bed. kwim? Put the blanket at armpit height, then tuck it in around the mattress so that it's fairly tight. It's supposed to discourage premature rolling, I think, and also avoid getting blankets over faces.

Of course, the 16 mo I have sleeps with his whole blanket over his whole body... half the time, he's sitting in the corner of the pnp, fast asleep underneath.

[juniper]

Thanks. Yeah, I should have mentioned she is in a sleep sack here now that she is not swaddled. It's interesting, I've never had a kid (nannied kids or my own son) who had trouble falling back asleep if I'd been in the room when they first fell asleep. Every kid is different, though.

My approach has been to rub her belly if she fusses but not to pick her up unless she is screaming. (Though now it seems crib = instant screaming.) That had worked so far but stopped working when she was out of the swaddle.

I am really not into CIO though I do appreciate your suggestion. This is the first baby I've cared for who has had such a hard time, possibly because the setup is different at home than at daycare??? My own son has sleep apnea but still had an easier time than this.

Mom is coming early for pickup today so we can talk about ideas. Apparently she slept really well at home this weekend though they're not sure why (she typically sleeps poorly everywhere.)

[Heidi]

Thanks. Yeah, I should have mentioned she is in a sleep sack here now that she is not swaddled. It's interesting, I've never had a kid (nannied kids or my own son) who had trouble falling back asleep if I'd been in the room when they first fell asleep. Every kid is different, though.

My approach has been to rub her belly if she fusses but not to pick her up unless she is screaming. (Though now it seems crib = instant screaming.) That had worked so far but stopped working when she was out of the swaddle.

I am really not into CIO though I do appreciate your suggestion. This is the first baby I've cared for who has had such a hard time, possibly because the setup is different at home than at daycare??? My own son has sleep apnea but still had an easier time than this.

Mom is coming early for pickup today so we can talk about ideas. Apparently she slept really well at home this weekend though they're not sure why (she typically sleeps poorly everywhere.)

My "method" is definately not CIO, but you've got to do what you're comfortable with. I honestly don't see much of a choice, though, to be honest. You cannot leave 3 other childre unattended while you snuggle with her for several hours.

I hope you gals figure it out! If you come up with something that works, please share, because I know this situation comes up a lot here.

[Play Care]

My "method" is definately not CIO, but you've got to do what you're comfortable with. I honestly don't see much of a choice, though, to be honest. You cannot leave 3 other childre unattended while you snuggle with her for several hours.

I hope you gals figure it out! If you come up with something that works, please share, because I know this situation comes up a lot here.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I see CIO as leaving a child to cry while the parent/caregiver does not go back in to check (I saw a Mad About You episode years ago that was a perfect example).

[Heidi]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I see CIO as leaving a child to cry while the parent/caregiver does not go back in to check (I saw a Mad About You episode years ago that was a perfect example).

I remember that episode! I was wondering the whole time WHY????? Never got what would motivate someone to go from one extreme to the other like that. It's one thing if a baby has been "spoiled " (sorry...lack of a better word) at home, and now a dcp has to "fix" it (again...lack of a better word). But, the PARENTS in the series created the situation, then took the most extreme opposite way to change it.

Ummm...ever heard of moderation, people?

[blandino]

I remember that episode! I was wondering the whole time WHY????? Never got what would motivate someone to go from one extreme to the other like that. It's one thing if a baby has been "spoiled " (sorry...lack of a better word) at home, and now a dcp has to "fix" it (again...lack of a better word). But, the PARENTS in the series created the situation, then took the most extreme opposite way to change it.

Ummm...ever heard of moderation, people?

Yes !!! My kids put themselves to sleep, and might fuss a little- and on occasion cry. But it is much like how Heidi explained her nap time in the thread last week, about sleep issues. They aren't crying for endless amounts of time - but on the other hand if I know that a child is fed, clean, and all other needs are met and they just don't want to lie down right now or want to be held/rocked to sleep, I do let them fuss or cry for a bit. But most of time time there is no extensive crying - just a little fussing and sleep.

My thought process (and I know some will disagree) is that you know what is best for that baby. It might not be exactly what they want at the minute, but it is what they need. So when a child wakes after 20 min (not even a full sleep cycle) I let them put themselves back to sleep. Especially considering this babie's age.

I have in the past sat right next to the baby's crib until they fell asleep, which I think let's them know they aren't abandoned, you are still there - but it is time to nap. Depending on what your other children are doing, that may or may not be a possibility.

Once again, AP'ers please don't jump all over me. I understand the philosophy of AP, and am not ignorant. I just happen to follow a different philosophy.

[youretooloud]

Why can't you use a woombie or something similar? http://www.woombie.com/woombie_air.html

I would also think she's ready to sleep on her tummy with her bum in the air. I think as long as she's rolling over, she's fine to sleep in whatever position is comfortable to her.

Some kids fuss to sleep. I wouldn't let her cry...but, i'd let her fuss.

I think her parents dropped the ball on this one, and it's going to be hard for you...but, I hope you find a gentle way to work it out. I couldn't let her cry either.

[Play Care]

Why can't you use a woombie or something similar? http://www.woombie.com/woombie_air.html

I would also think she's ready to sleep on her tummy with her bum in the air. I think as long as she's rolling over, she's fine to sleep in whatever position is comfortable to her.

Some kids fuss to sleep. I wouldn't let her cry...but, i'd let her fuss.

I think her parents dropped the ball on this one, and it's going to be hard for you...but, I hope you find a gentle way to work it out. I couldn't let her cry either.

With my older DD I was firmly against what I "considered" CIO. I responded to every cry (or what I thought was a cry...) ready to "fix" the situation. That led to many a night pacing the bedroom with her in my arms...I did the same thing for my younger child - every peep I was right there to comfort. Until one night I realized that her "cries" were not really "wah wah wah" but more like "eh eh eh" So one night I waited and a minute or so later it stopped. The next morning she was like a whole different child - WELL rested and happy. Turned out my attentiveness had been keeping her up. Lesson learned: no more firm "all or nothing" policy, but know thy child and respond accordingly

[Play Care]

I remember that episode! I was wondering the whole time WHY????? Never got what would motivate someone to go from one extreme to the other like that. It's one thing if a baby has been "spoiled " (sorry...lack of a better word) at home, and now a dcp has to "fix" it (again...lack of a better word). But, the PARENTS in the series created the situation, then took the most extreme opposite way to change it.

Ummm...ever heard of moderation, people?

The entire episode I was thinking "go get your baby!" as the child was WAILING They didn't have to pick her up, but even some gentle pats and shushing noises to reassure her that they were there. I swear my blood pressure spiked while I watched.

[Angelsj]

I do have one I still wear at that age. She was a premie, and she is quite tiny, but even fairly large infants are not terribly difficult to wear if you do it well. It works because she does sleep while being held even with the noise of the older kiddos.

That said, I am not opposed to CIO, IF (and that is a big IF) it is done properly.
I think a previous poster described it well, with just a few moments in between (not a long period.) An older baby can start to figure things out.