Gun Control

[MarinaVanessa]

On the same day as Sandy Hook, a man in China killed 22 students in a school with a knife. http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2...-in-china?lite

So no, guns don't kill people. Neither do knives. Or fertilizer. Or remote controls. What kills people is mentally unstable people.

In almost every single mass murder case, behind it lies a disturbed person. Until this country wakes up and realizes that we have a TERRIBLE lack of understanding about mental health, we will continue down this road. Navigating the mental health options in the US is a nightmare. Families cannot help and most of the time the individuals themselves are too unstable to help themselves or even realize they need help.

Read this very interesting blog post from a mother of a mentally ill child. It is really eye opening in many ways.
http://anarchistsoccermom.blogspot.c...thinkable.html

Well said.

[Country Kids]

I live in a state that has had several school shootings.
The first being in 1966.
The most "well-known" being either Red Lake or Cold Springs.

None of them used assault rifles. 2 of the more well known shootings included a .22 calibur pistol.

I don't believe that banning certain types of weapons will have any impact on this type of thing.

I personally do not hunt. I grew up in a hunting family. I know how to shoot many different types of guns. I do not personally own any guns. If I could afford to, I would.

Two of my immediate family members died at the hands of guns. Do I blame the guns? Nope.

I agree with what Brent said; "What we need IMO is to take care of ourselves/towns/state/country/world…our love, our spirit, our soul. What “makes” people do this is what needs our attention.

Interesting I've never heard of those shootings? Are they more known in your area or country wise?

Everytime they started a showing of school shootings this weekend it all started with Thurston High School. I had been there for things during high school myself and know it is well known place for soccer tournaments. I always get a heavy heart walking past the memorial for the students that died.

Now we have the Clackamas Mall shooting. A friend was telling me that when they were there this weekend, a mom was standing outside the mall trying to convince her child that they would be ok if they went inside. Oh, how sad that our children don't even feel safe to go shopping-. I guess they are still trying to figure that one out as the guy had nothing on him for past arrests/tickets. He was actually suppose to move to Hawaii this last Saturday.

[Binkybobo]

It's getting all political up in here. Why is that when the givernment pushes for laws that would make it harder for a young man like this to get these weapons everyone gets up in an uproar. BTW, I am fully aware that these guns were registered in his mother's name, but there have been many other cases where this has not been the case. I am not saying ban guns. I'm saying if having to wait a couple of weeks to be cleared to be able to purchase a weapon will save lives why do people have a with it? It is not like we are kids on Christmas morning! I can patiently wait for my background and sanity to be cleared if it will save lives. I know people will still find a way to get guns illegally, but every little bit counts. Honestly, I think that there are probably too many guns floating around for any kind of ban to ever work! I live in TX. Mexico is my neighbor. Good luck trying to take a cowboys gun away!.Have fun wasting money on the war on guns. They'll waste just as much money on this as they have wasted on the war on marajuana! Let's not start a sub-subject on that. We'll just keep digging ourselves deeper in debt for nonsense reasons. It'll be just as successful as the war on alcohol! Prohibition=Epic Fail

[laundrymom]

Copy & paste this for me, except, I have no ar15 although I asked santa for one.

I have to politely disagree with the assault rifle opinion. I am one of those that owns an AR-15, several hunting rifles and quite a few handguns. Licensing knows that we own them and we have showed them where they and the ammo is kept. I am a responsible gun enthusiast and follow all laws including following the requirements to owning the AR-15.

I think that instead of pointing fingers to place blame on gun control laws or to ban assault rifles our focus should be more on better access to mental health care for the general population. Or if anything, place blame where it is due ... such as the aggressors and perhaps parents if the agressor is a child.

If making something illegal will reduce or remove unwanted behavior and actions then why is that we still have a drug problem in america? Just because drugs are illegal does not make them inaccessible. I don't think that banning assault rifles will help matters because if someone determined to hurt someone can't get a hold of one then they'll simply use a handgun, a shotgun, a bomb, a knife, a brick, a baseball bat, a kitchen knife, a piece of rope ... anything they can get their hands on.

[Blackcat31]

Interesting I've never heard of those shootings? Are they more known in your area or country wise?

No, both are rather well known and had TONS of media coverage across the country.

Ricori High Cold Springs MN September 24, 2003 15 yr old shooter. Currently in prison and eligible for parole in 2038. Killed 2 students

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocori_High_School_shooting

Red Lake (Indian Reservation) Red Lake, MN March 21, 2005 16 yr old shooter. Committed suicide on site. 9 dead, 5 wounded 2 others killed before on campus killings

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Lake_massacre

[SunshineMama]

It's getting all political up in here. Why is that when the givernment pushes for laws that would make it harder for a young man like this to get these weapons everyone gets up in an uproar. BTW, I am fully aware that these guns were registered in his mother's name, but there have been many other cases where this has not been the case. I am not saying ban guns. I'm saying if having to wait a couple of weeks to be cleared to be able to purchase a weapon will save lives why do people have a with it? It is not like we are kids on Christmas morning! I can patiently wait for my background and sanity to be cleared if it will save lives. I know people will still find a way to get guns illegally, but every little bit counts. Honestly, I think that there are probably too many guns floating around for any kind of ban to ever work! I live in TX. Mexico is my neighbor. Good luck trying to take a cowboys gun away!.Have fun wasting money on the war on guns. They'll waste just as much money on this as they have wasted on the war on marajuana! Let's not start a sub-subject on that. We'll just keep digging ourselves deeper in debt for nonsense reasons. It'll be just as successful as the war on alcohol! Prohibition=Epic Fail

Many states actually do have wait-times to receive guns. I used to live in NC, and it took up to a week to get clearance for a handgun. The state I live in now does an automatic background check. From my understanding, Connecticut has some of the most stringent gun control laws in our country, yet the law did not protect the innocent. People who are going to commit a crime do not care about the law. The profile of the type of person who is going to shoot up a bunch of children, is the same type of calculated person who would find other ways to get around not having a gun.

By no coincidence all of the worst mass murders in US history have been non-gun:

Worst School Massacre in US history: Bath, Michigan School Massacre. 1927. Murder accomplished with explosives. 44 victims (equal to the Columbine and Virginia Tech massacres combined).

Worst Domestic Terrorist Attack in US History: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building bombing. 4/19/95. Murder accomplished with a rental truck full of fertilizer based explosives. 168 dead (including many children in an onsite day care).

Worst Foreign based Terrorist Attack in US History: September 11, 2001 attacks on NYC, PA, Pentagon. Murder accomplished with box cutters and commerical airliners. 3,000 people dead.
no guns needed.

This nut case in Colorado put a great deal of time and planning into his attack on the theater - I think it is very likely that if he didnt have access to guns he most likely would have found another weapon to get the job done and if the weapon he chose was explosives the results could have been much worse
the majority of terrorist attacks in recent times, most of which involve car bombs (London), attaché bombs on trains (Madrid), the Sarin gas attack in Tokyo, etc. (and in fact almost all modern terrorist attacks are done without guns)


Sorry this post is difficult to read- I think little fingers got to my computer and spilled some water on it My keyboard is a mess.

[Crystal]

I am one of those that believes that if you don't agree with something you have a right to your opinion ... but you don't have a right to force your opinions onto others that do not agree with you. Banning guns is doing just that, you are saying that because you do not believe in having certain types of weapons that I should have to give mine up even though I do not believe in that at all. And just as you will continue to write to your representative and sign petitions, so will I. The only difference is that you are saying that no one should have these types of guns ... I am not saying that everyone should be forced to own one. I think that if one does not believe in having them then it should be their choice not to have one just like if someone does then it should be their right to own one.

This can go both ways. Why are those of that are opposed to guns (not all guns) made to have the opinion of pro-gun advocates forced on us? Especially when we are seeing, almost daily, innocent people being killed?

Certainly there is to be considered that these people are mentally unstable....but what can we do to prevent these weapons being placed in the hands of those that are mentally disturbed? We cannot prevent it because these weapons are legal, and often we do not recognize that someone is mentally defunct UNTIL they commit these acts of horror. So, these mentally unstable people have access to these weapons and there is nothing anyone can do to stop them.

I am not neccessarily saying ban them altogether....BUT, there MUST be some sort of control in order to prevent this from happening. We cannot just sit around saying guns don't kill people, people kill people.....certainly the person pulls the trigger, but if they didn't have the weapon in the first place, it would not occur.

We can talk about responsible gun ownership until we are blue in the face. That isn't going to prevent unstable people from accessing guns and killing innocent people. SOMETHING has to be done to prevent this type of mass killing.

I wonder how many of these children's parents were advocates of the right to bear arms prior to this happening, and how many felt differently on December 14th.

[Crystal]

On the same day as Sandy Hook, a man in China killed 22 students in a school with a knife. http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2...-in-china?lite

So no, guns don't kill people. Neither do knives. Or fertilizer. Or remote controls. What kills people is mentally unstable people.

In almost every single mass murder case, behind it lies a disturbed person. Until this country wakes up and realizes that we have a TERRIBLE lack of understanding about mental health, we will continue down this road. Navigating the mental health options in the US is a nightmare. Families cannot help and most of the time the individuals themselves are too unstable to help themselves or even realize they need help.

Read this very interesting blog post from a mother of a mentally ill child. It is really eye opening in many ways.
http://anarchistsoccermom.blogspot.c...thinkable.html

Those children are still alive.....at least I am not seeing anywhere that it is reported that they are dead. The children who were SHOT at Sandy Hook are not.

[Binkybobo]

Many states actually do have wait-times to receive guns. I used to live in NC, and it took up to a week to get clearance for a handgun. The state I live in now does an automatic background check. From my understanding, Connecticut has some of the most stringent gun control laws in our country, yet the law did not protect the innocent. People who are going to commit a crime do not care about the law. The profile of the type of person who is going to shoot up a bunch of children, is the same type of calculated person who would find other ways to get around not having a gun.

By no coincidence all of the worst mass murders in US history have been non-gun:

Worst School Massacre in US history: Bath, Michigan School Massacre. 1927. Murder accomplished with explosives. 44 victims (equal to the Columbine and Virginia Tech massacres combined).

Worst Domestic Terrorist Attack in US History: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building bombing. 4/19/95. Murder accomplished with a rental truck full of fertilizer based explosives. 168 dead (including many children in an onsite day care).

Worst Foreign based Terrorist Attack in US History: September 11, 2001 attacks on NYC, PA, Pentagon. Murder accomplished with box cutters and commerical airliners. 3,000 people dead.
no guns needed.

This nut case in Colorado put a great deal of time and planning into his attack on the theater - I think it is very likely that if he didnt have access to guns he most likely would have found another weapon to get the job done and if the weapon he chose was explosives the results could have been much worse
the majority of terrorist attacks in recent times, most of which involve car bombs (London), attaché bombs on trains (Madrid), the Sarin gas attack in Tokyo, etc. (and in fact almost all modern terrorist attacks are done without guns)


Sorry this post is difficult to read- I think little fingers got to my computer and spilled some water on it My keyboard is a mess.

My entire post was devoted to saying how banning guns would be draining and pointless.

[Country Kids]

It doesn't just happen here:

http://listverse.com/2008/01/01/top-10-worst-school-massacres/

Please note its not just America. It is every where in every area of our world.

[Crystal]

It doesn't just happen here:

http://listverse.com/2008/01/01/top-10-worst-school-massacres/

Please note its not just America. It is every where in every area of our world.

Of course it is not just America. IMO, it doesn't matter where, it just matters that it DOES happen.

[daycarediva]

I have to politely disagree with the assault rifle opinion. I am one of those that owns an AR-15, several hunting rifles and quite a few handguns. Licensing knows that we own them and we have showed them where they and the ammo is kept. I am a responsible gun enthusiast and follow all laws including following the requirements to owning the AR-15.

I think that instead of pointing fingers to place blame on gun control laws or to ban assault rifles our focus should be more on better access to mental health care for the general population. Or if anything, place blame where it is due ... such as the aggressors and perhaps parents if the agressor is a child.

If making something illegal will reduce or remove unwanted behavior and actions then why is that we still have a drug problem in america? Just because drugs are illegal does not make them inaccessible. I don't think that banning assault rifles will help matters because if someone determined to hurt someone can't get a hold of one then they'll simply use a handgun, a shotgun, a bomb, a knife, a brick, a baseball bat, a kitchen knife, a piece of rope ... anything they can get their hands on.

Yes, this! I own guns, have them all inspected by licensing and my dcp's are all aware. I spent a solid YEAR to legally obtain my pistol permit. It would have taken my dh 20 minutes to drive downtown and $200 to obtain the SAME WEAPON illegally.

There is an ILLUSION of gun control. Just like there is the ILLUSION of drug control.

[Country Kids]

Of course it is not just America. IMO, it doesn't matter where, it just matters that it DOES happen.

My biggest, biggest question is why all very young boys and men. Seriously, the one that blew up the school in the 20's was higher person in the schools. Then the Texas Bell tower guy was intelligent from what I remember. Does something just snap in their mind.

[My3cents]

In light of many recent mass shootings, and because the great gun debate was started in a thread meant to honor victims, I a starting a new thread dedicated to gun control.

I am with those that beleive there needs to be limits as to which weapons are available to the public. I see nothing wrong with being able to own a weapon for protection or hunting, however I see no reason for the general population to have access to high powere assault weapons.

While there is always the (lame) argument that "guns don't kill people, people kill people" the truth of the matter is the people who are the perpetrators of mass shootings could not have killed more than a couple of people as opposed to dozens of people....THAT is why there needs to be limits to the type of weapons that these poeple can legally get their hands on.

I am sorry I commented on the other thread........

Key word here is legally--- If someone wants to cause destruction these weapons are out there, doesn't matter if they are legal or not. I don't think it went through his head that he was using a registered gun when he did what he did. I think it goes beyond gun control and more of a mental issue- Just how I see it. Again my heart aches for these families and kids and loved ones.

[daycarediva]

I strongly believe that if a person this mentally ill is planning to perpetrate violence on such a massive scale, they will do so, regardless of the legality of it. (of course). Bombs, biological weapons, etc.

If a private citizen had been ARMED at the school, a LOT less lives would have been taken. It takes the police FOR.EV.ER. to respond. If someone was shooting in/near my home, my husband (a licensed, non criminal, mentally stable, sharpshooting, gun owner) would respond within minutes.

If we take the LEGALLY obtained guns away from private citizens, it will only enable illegal weapons and criminals to have that much fear/control over us as a whole.