Feedback Please, Punishment

[Cat Herder]

"... and as such Childcare Providers would be providing written documentation, during the initial tour, that they have a history of ineffective classroom management if they incorporate a punishment plan into their program handbook."

Examples of punishment given:

* Time-Out
* Suspension
* Expulsion


And now your turn......

[Controlled Chaos]

I use time out as a last resort for older children...I know those options are extreme but are expulsion and terming a child the same thing?

[Cat Herder]

I use time out as a last resort for older children...I know those options are extreme but are expulsion and terming a child the same thing?

Yes, termination of child for behavioral issues is considered expulsion.

Termination of parent for payment issues is not.

(as a side note, termination of parents for their behavioral issues is also viewed as your failure... I will save that for a day my blood pressure is not so high. :

[KSDC]

Where is this quote from? My state requires us to have a written discipline plan AND the parents have to be informed of the policy. So, it is in my handbook that the parents get at the interview.

This is what I have:
Your child/children will be disciplined in a manner appropriate to the situation.
This discipline is not abusive and does NOT include corporal punishment. (Usual
discipline consists of redirection and cooling down periods.) If needed, we will
have a conference to discuss behavioral problems and ways to solve them.
Acceptable behavior is encouraged by giving positive verbal rewards.

[Cat Herder]

Where is this quote from? .

Parent education classes on choosing "appropriate" childcare sponsored by your tax dollars.

***I am not so much concerned with the who, where and when of the classes than the social acceptance of the concept as a whole.

Also, the current provider training says "discipline" is your curriculum, schedule and environment, not "punishment". Totally different birds. Discipline is to teach or guide. It is a vocabulary thing.

IYHO, Are childcare providers "unacceptable" if they are ever in the position of having to punish a child's behavior, birth to 12?

Of course you gals can take this topic where you want to, I will cherry pick what I need. I especially like it when my own view is challenged. Bring it. lovethis

[Blackcat31]

Having a temporary loss of higher brain functions today...

Can you re-phrase the question?


I am not understanding...

[Leigh]

Punishment is a last resort. And some kids actually only respond to it. Those kids, IME, are the ones who are punished at home. I had two little boys whose caregivers hit them-a lot. Those boys would respond only to removal of privileges and time-out. They would straight out ask me "are you going to spank me?". That is the ONLY thing they responded to. I work with a children's therapist often-she is the one who suggested time-out for these boys. For one of them, time-out for EVERY infraction (he had ODD and was 100% out of control). It ****ed for me to do it-I spent most of my day supervising him, but it did help him learn some self-control. Even though this one improved, I wound up terming when the brother's behavior started to escalate-no way was I going through that again!

I now try to screen out people who hit their kids at my interviews. It's not worth dealing with those parents or their kids to me.

Is punishment necessary? Sometimes.

[Annalee]

"... and as such Childcare Providers would be providing written documentation, during the initial tour, that they have a history of ineffective classroom management if they incorporate a punishment plan into their program handbook."

Examples of punishment given:

* Time-Out
* Suspension
* Expulsion


And now your turn......

I use the term "redirection" in my handbook.....removing the child from the situation.....I explain how important is it is for client/provider to work together....if a child reaches a point they are harming their own self or others repeatedly, they will be terminated...I have only terminated 4 times in 22 plus years of child care... Only one of the terminations were for bad behavior, the others were because of the clients not following contract/policy.

[Cat Herder]

Can you re-phrase the question?

Absolutely

In your honest opinion, are childcare providers "unacceptable" (unprofessional, not appropriate) if they are ever in the position of having to punish a child's behavior, birth to 12?

Is it really a sign that the provider is incompetent in classroom management technique? Poor training? Uneducated?

(If you want to add the clarified question to the original post, feel free. I am not sure I'd do it right.)

[daycarediva]

I feel like my OWN head is going to explode. Call me incompetent, uneducated, and lacking in classroom management skills, but a child typically comes to me with some behavior that either isn't acceptable in group care or I don't allow in my home. I use TO for any aggression, and everything else is a rule reminder /'make better choices' conversation. My kids are all 2+.

I also, *gasp* discipline my OWN children, is that considered poor "home" management?

I think this lack of discipline is creating an entire generation of children who believe there are no consequences for their actions. It is NEVER the child's fault, and they will never learn to take responsibility for anything!

[KidGrind]

:confused:

I feel like I’ve stepped into a hornet’s nest.

[Cat Herder]

:confused:

I feel like I’ve stepped into a hornet’s nest.

No, no.... It is for a compare/contrast piece. :::: I can really see both sides and am on the fence... I think that is my sneaky professors plan. To confuse and daze. ::::::

You can even give two (or ten) viewpoints and never reveal which one is yours...

I love devils advocate posts.

The point is to really think on it and reflect from various perspectives. Parent, provider, former daycare kid, teacher or next door neighbor.

It also makes for a great debate.

[EntropyControlSpecialist]

I feel like my OWN head is going to explode. Call me incompetent, uneducated, and lacking in classroom management skills, but a child typically comes to me with some behavior that either isn't acceptable in group care or I don't allow in my home. I use TO for any aggression, and everything else is a rule reminder /'make better choices' conversation. My kids are all 2+.

I also, *gasp* discipline my OWN children, is that considered poor "home" management?

I think this lack of discipline is creating an entire generation of children who believe there are no consequences for their actions. It is NEVER the child's fault, and they will never learn to take responsibility for anything!

This. ALL this.

Our society is going so far away from the Bible that anything mentioned in it has become bad. Discipline, punishment, consequences...all apart of it. Bam.

[KSDC]

I see it as a difference between discipline and punishment.

Discipline is all the things we do to help teach a child the socially acceptable ways to behave. This includes routines and schedules. Encouraging positive behavior with "high fives" and positive verbal praise. Teaching "good" behaviors.

AND, it includes stopping negative behaviors. This includes verbal correction and redirection. It can also include removing the child from whatever it was that was influencing the poor behavior choices.

This is all part and parcel of "discipline" by my definition.

Punishment is just giving negative consequences for "bad" behavior.

Just my two cents...

[Annalee]

This. ALL this.

Our society is going so far away from the Bible that anything mentioned in it has become bad. Discipline, punishment, consequences...all apart of it. Bam.

I agree with this wholeheartedly and firmly believe in accountability/responsiblity, but i use the "redirection" approach for daycare due to state regulations...I have become crafty with redirection leading to a sense of consequences for the child's actions.....I DO NOT use redirection in my own home but that is a whole other topic