Terming Aggressive 20 Month Old - Is This Fair?

[Heidi]

I don't think it's a boy behavior either but it IS a 20 month old behavior.

I would be concerned about the 13 month old but not because I was afraid they are going to leave but because mom is concerned about her child.

I understand that she actually witnessed this but I also think she needs to understand that 99.9% of toddlers learn via physical interaction and that rough and gentle have NO meaning to a child under age 2.

They need to be taught this.

I would definitely have a discussion with the 20 month old's parents but I would not classify this as any more than normal.

A group of toddlers ARE going to be physical. A group of toddlers ARE going to push, pull, hit, and try to "fight" for what they want/need in whatever manner they know and right now at 13 and 20 months, all they know is physical. Communication skills are just emerging at that age and impulse control is virtually nil so having the right expectations about what will and won't happen is necessary for a parent when they enroll their child in GROUP care.

How many little ones do you have?

I mean no disrespect to your DH but was he actually watching the toddlers or was he doing multiple things at once so his eyes weren't actually on the 20 month old? Sometimes, that is the problem... honestly you really do have to have your eyes on a toddler at ALL times or provide them with an environment that doesn't allow for them to be physical with others.

I have the same issues here, at times. It's frustrating to me that I can't multi-task. Honestly, sometimes, it's very boring to sit there actually watching them play, just to intervene in case of trouble. But, I do know it's part of the job.

[hwichlaz]

I don't think it's a boy behavior either but it IS a 20 month old behavior.

I would be concerned about the 13 month old but not because I was afraid they are going to leave but because mom is concerned about her child.

I understand that she actually witnessed this but I also think she needs to understand that 99.9% of toddlers learn via physical interaction and that rough and gentle have NO meaning to a child under age 2.

They need to be taught this.

I would definitely have a discussion with the 20 month old's parents but I would not classify this as any more than normal.

A group of toddlers ARE going to be physical. A group of toddlers ARE going to push, pull, hit, and try to "fight" for what they want/need in whatever manner they know and right now at 13 and 20 months, all they know is physical. Communication skills are just emerging at that age and impulse control is virtually nil so having the right expectations about what will and won't happen is necessary for a parent when they enroll their child in GROUP care.

How many little ones do you have?

I mean no disrespect to your DH but was he actually watching the toddlers or was he doing multiple things at once so his eyes weren't actually on the 20 month old? Sometimes, that is the problem... honestly you really do have to have your eyes on a toddler at ALL times or provide them with an environment that doesn't allow for them to be physical with others.

While this is true, there are certainly children that take it to such an extreme that they have to have an extra caregiver or be the only/youngest/smallest in the group etc. For me, this is the same child that's been climbing out of the playpen since her 1st birthday, and she's out as fast as you can put her in. Some kids are just on the extreme side of physical. I do have a smaller baby in care, but she's almost a full year younger and happy to hang out in the baby corral, which my 18 month old has zero interest in. In the non baby corral group, this X-games kid is the smallest.

[MCC]

I don't think it's a boy behavior either but it IS a 20 month old behavior.

I would be concerned about the 13 month old but not because I was afraid they are going to leave but because mom is concerned about her child.

I understand that she actually witnessed this but I also think she needs to understand that 99.9% of toddlers learn via physical interaction and that rough and gentle have NO meaning to a child under age 2.

They need to be taught this.

I would definitely have a discussion with the 20 month old's parents but I would not classify this as any more than normal.

A group of toddlers ARE going to be physical. A group of toddlers ARE going to push, pull, hit, and try to "fight" for what they want/need in whatever manner they know and right now at 13 and 20 months, all they know is physical. Communication skills are just emerging at that age and impulse control is virtually nil so having the right expectations about what will and won't happen is necessary for a parent when they enroll their child in GROUP care.

How many little ones do you have?

I mean no disrespect to your DH but was he actually watching the toddlers or was he doing multiple things at once so his eyes weren't actually on the 20 month old? Sometimes, that is the problem... honestly you really do have to have your eyes on a toddler at ALL times or provide them with an environment that doesn't allow for them to be physical with others.

Thank you for this response.

He doesn't seem to be doing this b/c he wants a toy or wants something at all. He will be clear across the room from 13 mo and just charge at him and bring him to the ground. I really feel like this is something that is being encouraged at home.

I have 7 kids under 3.5, so they are all little. I also have a full time assistant. At drop off yesterday there was a 3.5 year old (my DD), a 3 yo, 20mo DCB and 13 mo DCB had just arrived. When DCM dropped 13mo over the gate to the playroom, 20 mo old charged at him and took him to the ground.

My H is great with the kids, but he does scroll through the internet on occasion, or get side tracked playing something with the 3 year olds and forgets he needs to hawk eye the toddlers. However, yesterday he was talking to DCM while she was dropping off her kid, so I feel like he was pretty much right there when it happened.

[Blackcat31]

Thank you for this response.

He doesn't seem to be doing this b/c he wants a toy or wants something at all. He will be clear across the room from 13 mo and just charge at him and bring him to the ground. I really feel like this is something that is being encouraged at home.

I have 7 kids under 3.5, so they are all little. I also have a full time assistant. At drop off yesterday there was a 3.5 year old (my DD), a 3 yo, 20mo DCB and 13 mo DCB had just arrived. When DCM dropped 13mo over the gate to the playroom, 20 mo old charged at him and took him to the ground.

My H is great with the kids, but he does scroll through the internet on occasion, or get side tracked playing something with the 3 year olds and forgets he needs to hawk eye the toddlers. However, yesterday he was talking to DCM while she was dropping off her kid, so I feel like he was pretty much right there when it happened.

I would look at your drop off procedures... maybe make it so that the other kids do not have direct access to those kids being dropped off. That way, the 20 month can't bee line for the younger one.

I am betting your DH is great! Most men don't like to be that hands on so please know I was NOT implying your DH wasn't being a good caregiver...just that sometimes yes, we do have to have a constant eye on toddlers...especially those that are more physical. I had a toddler bite another on the back WHILE on my lap so I do know how it only takes a second for something to happen. They are quick little buggars. ::

As for the running across the room....stop him mid-step and STERNLY say "NO!"

Use your "I am NOT kidding" voice each time you anticipate him being physical. Even if he is seeing this at home or even participating in wrestling matches with dad, he can still learn appropriate behavior at your house. Kids are quick to decipher what flies at one place and not another.

If necessary keep a PNP set up in the corner and each time he is intercepted from being physical with someone else, give him a firm "NO!" and plop him in the PNP. with NO other attention for his behavior. Then shower the anticipated victim with love and attention. SHOW dcb that good behavior earns attention.

When you leave the room or are busy doing something that doesn't allow you to directly keep your eyes on him, plop him in the PNP. Remove him immediately upon returning.

If possible, I'd try and get a super play yard verses a PNP as it seems to work better but a PNP will work just so long as it isn't the same one or in the same area that he naps in because you don't want him to equate the PNP to punishment and napping...kwim? ...otherwise you might just cause some napping issues.

Rinse and repeat. He WILL get it. He is just stuck in between being a baby where EVERY little need he had and every move he made was addressed quickly and as cute. Now you have to unteach him all of that.

That is what makes toddlers hard. We tend to every need they have as infants and then as toddlers we wonder why they are so self centered and needy. ::

[TwinKristi]

Well the 13 month old's moms does need to remember her child is in group care, not a bubble, with other children and although this is a bit extreme, kids will be physical with each other at some point like BC said. It's part of learning. But it's our job to teach them boundaries and what is and isn't okay. That 13 month old may also be a handful n 7 mos, you never know!! Until they start showing these behaviors we can't correct it.
I know how some parents are with their babies and they get very protective and concerned. Their child's care during the day is out of their hands so having a good relationship with the baby's mom and knowing you, your dh & assistant are all taking good care is important during a time like this.
Aggressive DCB's mom does need to try and cut down the rough housing at home though. It really does carry through to their peer interactions.

[Cradle2crayons]

When mine were little... I admit we did a little rough housing. But they were only allowed to do it with US, not friends or siblings. And it was only allowed during a certain time or situation. And when we said wrestling was over, it was over.

We actually did a very minor family type wrestling. The kids giggled more than they rough housed. And it was never an issue.

But I really think either some kids don't understand here is a time and place for everything or they just aren't taught personal boundaries to go along with it maybe.

OP, IMHO. It's your job to protect the others and I see you are taking that seriously!!

I'd out the mom of the agressive child on notice and behavior probation for two weeks and work together to get a game plan.

Good luck!!

[MCC]

Thank you all so very much for your comments!

I talked to DCM of 20 mo today at pick up. She was really taken a back, which is strange b/c this isn't the first time I've mentioned it to her.

I told her I wanted to work on it together as a team for the next two weeks, and then we would sit down and talk about whether my care was a good fit for DCB.

I am going to bring my super yard out and use it to trap him during drop offs and when he gets aggressive. My only hesitation with this is he is going to whine and complain, and he has one of the least pleasant whines, but oh well, we will deal.

[llpa]

Thank you all so very much for your comments!

I talked to DCM of 20 mo today at pick up. She was really taken a back, which is strange b/c this isn't the first time I've mentioned it to her.

I told her I wanted to work on it together as a team for the next two weeks, and then we would sit down and talk about whether my care was a good fit for DCB.

I am going to bring my super yard out and use it to trap him during drop offs and when he gets aggressive. My only hesitation with this is he is going to whine and complain, and he has one of the least pleasant whines, but oh well, we will deal.

Good for you! Well done. And super yard is a good way to contain him when needed. Hopefully you will be able to move forward w him but you have set the boundaries. Now it's up to dcm to enforce it at home. You can comfortably say goodby if you need to because you have given mom every opportunity to help him! :hug:

[EntropyControlSpecialist]

Thank you all so very much for your comments!

I talked to DCM of 20 mo today at pick up. She was really taken a back, which is strange b/c this isn't the first time I've mentioned it to her.

I told her I wanted to work on it together as a team for the next two weeks, and then we would sit down and talk about whether my care was a good fit for DCB.

I am going to bring my super yard out and use it to trap him during drop offs and when he gets aggressive. My only hesitation with this is he is going to whine and complain, and he has one of the least pleasant whines, but oh well, we will deal.

That sounds like you did a great job and placing him in the play yard during drop-offs will show the 13mo's Mom that you are taking it seriously.

[MCC]

Well- DCM told me at drop off that they want to talk on Monday morning, both DCM and DCD. I'm just going to have to assume they are terming over this.

[Blackcat31]

Well- DCM told me at drop off that they want to talk on Monday morning, both DCM and DCD. I'm just going to have to assume they are terming over this.

Is this the 20 month old's parents or the 13 month old's parents?

[MCC]

Is this the 20 month old's parents or the 13 month old's parents?

The 20 month old.

I really feel like this can be resolved, and I don't want them to term.

I really am trying to take your advice and not think in terms of money, but I already have one opening right now, and having 2 openings puts me in a very uncomfortable spot, and having to tap into savings.

I also am feeling discouraged b/c this is now child 3 in the past 15 months that I've had to address behavior issues with, and the parents term immediately without trying to resolve the issues. It's hard to not think it's me causing the issue or wording something wrong with parents.

[Blackcat31]

The 20 month old.

I really feel like this can be resolved, and I don't want them to term.

I really am trying to take your advice and not think in terms of money, but I already have one opening right now, and having 2 openings puts me in a very uncomfortable spot, and having to tap into savings.

I also am feeling discouraged b/c this is now child 3 in the past 15 months that I've had to address behavior issues with, and the parents term immediately without trying to resolve the issues. It's hard to not think it's me causing the issue or wording something wrong with parents.

I am sure they are just wanting some clarification about what is happening. No one wants to think it is THEIR child that is the cause of daily issues for everyone else...kwim?

I would really try and make the meeting positive and let them know that you don't want them to leave because you are more than willing to work through these issues with them. Nothing is forever and this child's behavior IS going to change and the parents will need to know that you aren't going to bail in them whenever there is an issue.

I think parents just really need to know that we DO want to work with them and muddle through this together.

I would make sure they understand that you are not blaming anyone for anything and that the issue at hand IS temporary IF everyone is open and honest and working towards the same goal.

Make a big deal about how much you value that kind if relationship so they really feel that you ARE trying to make this work. Let them know you are trying because you DO care about their child and his (as well as everyone else's well-being is a priority)

I am sure because it is their child causing the stress that you may be thinking they are the problem when in reality kids go through all sorts of phases and as caregivers and parents, we just need to make sure we are on the same page and supporting one another by doing what is best for the child and the group he belongs to.

Who knows, in a couple months their kid could be the one getting picked on by an older child... things change, kids go through phases and the whole point of needing to have them aware of what is happening is so that everyone is safe, respected and cared for in one harmonious environment.

[MCC]

I am sure they are just wanting some clarification about what is happening. No one wants to think it is THEIR child that is the cause of daily issues for everyone else...kwim?

I would really try and make the meeting positive and let them know that you don't want them to leave because you are more than willing to work through these issues with them. Nothing is forever and this child's behavior IS going to change and the parents will need to know that you aren't going to bail in them whenever there is an issue.

I think parents just really need to know that we DO want to work with them and muddle through this together.

I would make sure they understand that you are not blaming anyone for anything and that the issue at hand IS temporary IF everyone is open and honest and working towards the same goal.

Make a big deal about how much you value that kind if relationship so they really feel that you ARE trying to make this work. Let them know you are trying because you DO care about their child and his (as well as everyone else's well-being is a priority)

I am sure because it is their child causing the stress that you may be thinking they are the problem when in reality kids go through all sorts of phases and as caregivers and parents, we just need to make sure we are on the same page and supporting one another by doing what is best for the child and the group he belongs to.

Who knows, in a couple months their kid could be the one getting picked on by an older child... things change, kids go through phases and the whole point of needing to have them aware of what is happening is so that everyone is safe, respected and cared for in one harmonious environment.

Thank you very much. I am hopeful that me and the parents can sit down and have a open and honest conversation on Monday.

[nannyde]

I think parents just really need to know that we DO want to work with them and muddle through this together.

I think the parent wants to know that the kid gets to do what he wants and that not only is it okay but it's a sign of his special "boys will be boys" behavior.

I think this OP has had parents term as soon as anything was brought to light because they want their kid to behave the way they do. They like it. They think it's adorable. They may even think it's advanced.

My answer to her would be that I am not a "boys will be boys" day care and he may want that. He wants to get physical and take down kids. He loves the excitement of it. I just can't host that. I can't afford to pay the medical on "boys will be boys". I can't afford the loss of clients who have children on the receiving end of "boys will be boys.

I'm not judging "boys will be boys". I'm totally okay with it and know there are LEGIONS of parents of boys who dig that. I just can't host it.